Sagging leaf springs - 1983 New Horizon MH

[JackP]

Looking for advice regarding best solution:

• Replace the old springs? I haven't located a source online. All the springs I've found were for the Toyota pickups and 4wd models.
  
• Have the old springs re-tempered somewhere? No idea where to have this done.
  
• Add helper springs? Again, none I've located online say they'll fit the MH. They're all for 4wd or pickups.
  

Any advice will be appreciated.

[Davidadro]

I don't believe Toyota made special Springs for the Motorhome, as the manufacturer of each home used either the 3/4 or 1 ton pick up chassis to build upon. I would think that if you got the leaf springs for your year 1 ton rating they would work. Helper springs for the pick up model couldent hurt as well. Can anyone else confirm?

[90toydolphin]

can't imagine the motorhome makers changed the stprings that came from toyota.

[Derek up North]

Grab your Yellow Pages and look up things like 'Truck Springs', 'Truck Suspension' or similar. You're not looking for pickup type places, rather somewhere that works on the big rigs. It might be helpful to them if you get yours weighed (including just the weight on the rear axle). Do you have 'Air Springs' (bags) installed?

[Davidadro]

Did the 83 come with air bags?

[Derek up North]

Don't know, but they might have been added over the last 30 years.

[JackP]

Hi readers. Thanks for all the replies. I only acquired the truck a week ago, so there's a ot I don't know about it yet.

I've been searching online, JC Whitney and various spring and suspension sites to no avail, thus far. My current thought is that I'm going to have to get it far enough off the ground to measure the springs, count the leafs and spend some phone time with suppliers. The decal says it's a New Horizon, but I haven't found Toyota New Horizon listed anywhere among the available springs for that model. Pickup's an option, and on one site, Commercial truck.

Davidadro: No specifications for dual wheel axle or such. I've seen no 3/4 or 1-ton ratings in their standard menus, either.

Derek up North: The truck's so low to the ground I can't tell what's under there at the moment. Guess the next step's going to be raising it up to learn as much as I'm able. I'll try to find a place to get it weighed, as well.

I appreciate your suggestions. JackP

[WME]

Toyota 1 ton C&C is what to look for.

[Davidadro]

Hi readers. Thanks for all the replies. I only acquired the truck a week ago, so there's a ot I don't know about it yet.

I've been searching online, JC Whitney and various spring and suspension sites to no avail, thus far. My current thought is that I'm going to have to get it far enough off the ground to measure the springs, count the leafs and spend some phone time with suppliers. The decal says it's a New Horizon, but I haven't found Toyota New Horizon listed anywhere among the available springs for that model. Pickup's an option, and on one site, Commercial truck.

Davidadro: No specifications for dual wheel axle or such. I've seen no 3/4 or 1-ton ratings in their standard menus, either.

Derek up North: The truck's so low to the ground I can't tell what's under there at the moment. Guess the next step's going to be raising it up to learn as much as I'm able. I'll try to find a place to get it weighed, as well.

I appreciate your suggestions. JackP

I think you are going about your spring process in the thinking that the leaf springs and suspension come from the maker of the motorhome you are driving? The Chassis, motor, drive train, components and suspension are all Toyota. The only things really, that come from the brand of home you own is what was built upon the Toyota pickup frame. Meaning, there aren’t going to be seperate springs listed for New Horizon, Dolphin, SunRader, Winnebago, etc. The springs are allToyota measurements, just as our shocks, axles, brakes and rims are. I think if you purchase the Toyota 1 ton Pick-up springs for your model year, you will find they will fit, and be exactly what you need. If you wish to put some helper spring stacks on as well, they also would be the ones that fit the Toyota rear leaf springs for the year you have. Good Luck!

[JackP]

WME: Thanks.

I probably should have mentioned I'm living in the middle of nowhere about 40 miles from Kerrville, Texas. Planning to move into this Toyota and live in it, travel to West Texas / Southern NM before winter sets in.

Which is to say, I might have to learn to live with what I've got. I see on the web there's a spring/suspension repair place in San Antonio, but it's a goodly distance east of me, and I live on a Social Security pension, so trips that distance in the wrong direction aren't appealing to me.

Maybe I can find something in San Angelo, Midland/Odessa. But I can't spend a lot on getting a fix done.

I websearched looking for air bag kits, still finding nothing for the 1983.

Might be possible to jury-rig something if all else fails, I reckons.

Thanks again. J

[JackP]

Davidadro: That's helpful info, clarifies things more for me. I'll look into whether something's out there just for the 1 ton. Trying to do this just web searching is leading me a lot of directions, a learning experience, but thus far I don't think I'm nearer a solution than I was insofar as actually locating springs. But I'm not all that well versed in computerized searches, so I might be going about it all wrong.

Are you suggesting my best bet might be going directly to a Toyota dealer, say in Kerrville, and have them order a set of leaf springs for a 1983 1-ton for me?

Sheeze, I honestly hadn't thought of that. Gracias, J

[JackP]

If you have, or want to install a air ride suspension for the 1983 Toyota pickup

http://www.etrailer....eid=19831113060

Here are rear springs for the 1983, they say 4x4 and they would be fine as they were more heavy than the regular springs

http://www.sdtrucksp...roducts_id=8745

Here are the helper springs for the 1983

http://www.sdtrucksp...roducts_id=1351

Thanks again Davidadro. I'd seen those during my web searches but assumed because they were talking about pickups and 4wds the dual axle was something different. I'm grateful to you. JackP

[Davidadro]

Davidadro: That's helpful info, clarifies things more for me. I'll look into whether something's out there just for the 1 ton. Trying to do this just web searching is leading me a lot of directions, a learning experience, but thus far I don't think I'm nearer a solution than I was insofar as actually locating springs. But I'm not all that well versed in computerized searches, so I might be going about it all wrong.

Are you suggesting my best bet might be going directly to a Toyota dealer, say in Kerrville, and have them order a set of leaf springs for a 1983 1-ton for me?

Sheeze, I honestly hadn't thought of that. Gracias, J

If you have, or want to install a air ride suspension for the 1983 Toyota pickup, $182.25 after rebate

http://www.etrailer....eid=19831113060

Here are rear springs for the 1983, they say 4x4 and they would be fine as they were more heavy than the regular springs

http://www.sdtrucksp...roducts_id=8745

Here are the add a leaf spring product to make the stack equilivent to what is on the ones you have:

http://www.sdtrucksprings.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&products_id=9443

Here are the helper springs for the 1983

http://www.sdtrucksp...roducts_id=1351

[Davidadro]

Thanks again Davidadro. I'd seen those during my web searches but assumed because they were talking about pickups and 4wds the dual axle was something different. I'm grateful to you. JackP

You are welcome. I think the confusion is with the dually mentality. Remember, most older units didn’t have true dually, just a regular rear axle modified only by two rims bolted in reverse together. When the recall was imposed to change the rear axle, thay had to use something that would bolt to the existing suspension, which of course was the Toyota pickup truck components. You will be ok, and I'm sorry if my posts have seemed redundant here, but It seems the connection problems to the site are occuring again. If you plan to change these things yourself, be sure they come with, or get new bolts and fasteners, and expect to have to cut the old ones off, as they are no doubt rust fused by now. It's not real difficult, but will need some physical effort. I wish you the best!

[Gary_M]

JackP, Did you look behind the driver seat and see if there were air valves? This would tell you if air bags were installed. Well, at least on mine that's where they are located.

Cheers,

Gary

Edited August 26, 2012 by Gary_M

[Derek up North]

I've never heard of them located there before. I've usually seen them on the side of the house near the rear wheel or tucked inside the wheel well.

Jack, you're looking for what looks like a couple of standard tire valves. These would indicate that you have/had air springs.

[JackP]

Gary M and Derek up North: Thanks for the suggestion. I've done a lot of nosing around looking under and behind everything I could get loose, found a number of things I don't know what are, but nothing I'd describe in that way.

Turned out the generator is not bolted down and the wiring is all disconnected, bouncing around in the compartment, for instance. But I haven't found any air valves. If I get a chance today I'm going to lie down on the ground and reach under with a camera to try to get some pictures of the rear-suspension, springs and whatever else is under there.

I've got a flock of chickens I'm getting rid of, used to running free I'll be keeping up today because a man's coming out to get them, might take a considerable while catching them and getting them penned so he can transport them. So I mightn't be spending a lot of time on the truck issues until tomorrow.

But I'm finding enough issues to satisfy most usual purposes.

Thanks to all of you for the suggestions.

Jack P

[85mirage]

Ditto what derek said. Go to a specialty big truck leaf spring place. They should only install springs and nothing else. Searching on the net for springs is a waste of time. Anything you find will be ineffective for our heavy homes. And shipping would be expensive. A new set of leaf springs will be more durable than air bags and will last another 30 years.. Expect to pay $400-600 for new leaf springs. I think i paid $500 and not only are they new but they added a few which is what you need. I would then recommend getting new rear shocks.If distance is a problem just wait till you hit the road it will be well worth it.

[Derek up North]

Jack, you mentioned living full time in NM. You might like to read this:-

http://www.andybaird.com/travels/

[Dolphinite no longer here]

Jack,

Just a note here...Whenever you go to an auto parts store for stuff you need, only say you "need a (part here) for an '83 Toyota Pickup." Since Toyota didn't make the coach or motorhome section, no auto parts store will have a listing in their catalogs for an "83 Toyota motorhome." Also 4WD springs should make quite a difference in your ride. Did you find any evidence of air bags, yet?

John

[JackP]

Jack,

Just a note here...Whenever you go to an auto parts store for stuff you need, only say you "need a (part here) for an '83 Toyota Pickup." Since Toyota didn't make the coach or motorhome section, no auto parts store will have a listing in their catalogs for an "83 Toyota motorhome." Also 4WD springs should make quite a difference in your ride. Did you find any evidence of air bags, yet?

John

Hi John and others who've mentioned air bags.

I got these pics lying on the ground, reaching up with a camera, but it certainly adds in information what it lacks in photo quality.

I count seven [7] springs including the short one.

Lots of springs toward the center and not much out toward the ends.

No air bags to speak of, and I don't think it's what I expected to see in the way of springs, but I never paid a lot of attention to springs before now.

[WME]

http://www.sdtrucksprings.com/

Check out all the stuff for Toyotas espically the Timbren line.

The correct thing is new spring packs the shop can add more leafs to make it ride level, they will last 20-30 years

Next is air bags they last 10-20 years.

Last choice is re-arching your springs and adding some new leafs. That lasts 2-5 years

Many times the spring bushings are just wore out and that will drop the rear end 1-2 inches.

[linda s]

Someone has already added extra springs on his looks like several times. Those new springs are less money than adding more leafs to those old ones and would be less weight. I'm guessing you seriously need new shocks too. The good thing is you do have the full floater axle upgrade. Someone in the past has spent a lot of money maintaining that rig. Get the new springs and shocks and see how it looks then.

Linda S

[JackP]

http://www.sdtrucksprings.com/

Check out all the stuff for Toyotas espically the Timbren line.

The correct thing is new spring packs the shop can add more leafs to make it ride level, they will last 20-30 years

Next is air bags they last 10-20 years.

Last choice is re-arching your springs and adding some new leafs. That lasts 2-5 years

Many times the spring bushings are just wore out and that will drop the rear end 1-2 inches.

WME: I'm obliged. Looks to be sound reasoning. Gracias, J

[JackP]

Someone in the past has spent a lot of money maintaining that rig. Get the new springs and shocks and see how it looks then.

Linda S

Hi Linda and thanks. It's deceptive. I mainly was thinking engine and drive train when I bought it, didn't know a thing about the things to look for on the camper part. Engine's low mileage - 73,000 miles on the 22R powerplant. Everything looked good.

The guy who owned it first got killed in a plane crash and his widow had it sitting out in the yard 15 years. Then a man whom I bought it from had it seven years, fixing it up but not using it much. His business crashed, he said, and he relocated to Arkansas and claimed that was the reason he was selling it cheap.

But after acquiring it and reading here I've learned a lot about what I should have been looking for.

Turns out there was a lot of water leakage through the rough for a long time, through the overhead. Front window's crystalized and now has a crack. And the retrofitted [what I originally thought were luggage rack bars] steel across the top are probably structural, keeping things together laterally.

I'm not complaining, though. I think it will last as long as I do, or the cats do. Gracias, JackP

[Bob C]

My '88 Escaper was hanging low in the rear end. I installed a Ride-Rite air bag system from 3-T's RV supply in Arizona. It cost about $385 and took me less than 3 hours to install. I am very happy with the improvement in the ride. They said that it would take about 500 miles for the springs to get rid of their improper bend. I could tell the difference right away. I no longer bottom out on bumps that would have me riding a buckboard before the air-ride.

I highly recommend the Ride-Rite system.

[Derek up North]

"They said that it would take about 500 miles for the springs to get rid of their improper bend."

I'm afraid I can't think of any engineering theory that covers this. Fatigued and tire is fatigued and tired. Steel springs aren't 'self-healing'.

[Maineah]

The 7 leaf pack should be enough but as every one has said go to a truck shop they can make springs for you that would haul 5 tons, springs do get old (I wish I could still lift 250# ). Most good shops can build spring packs far better then any on line replacements. To me air bags correct inadequate springs I would rather good springs then a glorified inner tube.

[Derek up North]

I wish I could still lift 250#

I still can. 50# at a time. Older and wiser!

[JackP]

For what it's worth: The good old Texas country boys who make a lifestyle of dealing with things on the cheap have suggested the first thing I ought to do is lift this thing up and do some measuring to see whether I can put the spring on top of the axle. They think I might raise it 3-4 inches that way, save a few hundred bucks and put some of it into new shock absorbers.

I'm thinking at least I'll lift it up for a look.

Thanks all for great suggestions and info. JackP

[Derek up North]

I think you'd end up lifting it a lot more than that. But too much, I think. I'm guessing by the diameter of the axle plus the thickness of the spring pack.

[Davidadro]

For what it's worth: The good old Texas country boys who make a lifestyle of dealing with things on the cheap have suggested the first thing I ought to do is lift this thing up and do some measuring to see whether I can put the spring on top of the axle. They think I might raise it 3-4 inches that way, save a few hundred bucks and put some of it into new shock absorbers.

I'm thinking at least I'll lift it up for a look.

Thanks all for great suggestions and info. JackP

I guess my only concern with this solution would be the way your shocks link to your spring stack shackle/mount at the bottom? If you move the axle below the stack, your shackle will be in the opposite position or maybe backwards on the round side where it attaches to axle, and your shock geometry might be compromised? Just a thought, and good luck with you continuing project!

[JackP]

Derek and Davidadro: There's a good chance either, or both of you are correct. I hope I'll be able to get a better feel for the implications once I get it lifted for a better look. If it seems okay eyeballing and measuring I'll release the axle from the springs, reposition the springs and see what doesn't fit or geehaw. Might have to buy a different length shock, or mightn't be able to live with something else about it. Might be the ride will be compromised too much for the needle-ball-and airspeed to keep me flyng straight and level.

But my labor's cheap and the cost of a new set of springs with someone else doing the work would mean stalling things a lot waiting for the next pension check. If it doesn't work I'll just have to change things back to the original configuration, hopefully no worse for the wear.

Thanks. JackP

[Maineah]

Any other thing to think about is razing the center of gravity they are all ready a bit top heavy.

[JackP]

Any other thing to think about is razing the center of gravity they are all ready a bit top heavy.

Maineah: A worthy concern. At the moment the CG's lowered enough to drag the dolly-wheels at every opportunity. I suspect raising it, even back to the original, will make a difference I'll notice. And having those springs atop the axle, instead of below it won't add any new strength to them. They'll just be sagging from a few inches more altitude. Hopefully I'll have whatever wisdom's needed to evaluate it once I take it down the road a bit for testing, assuming the mounting project is possible.

Thanks for the observations. I welcome them all. Gracias, JackP