sherrie Posted September 20, 2015 Author Share Posted September 20, 2015 Hi everyone following this thread. Friday the new AISIN water pump was installed. I also had the new AISIN timing belt installed. The old water pump looked pretty good when it was removed. When the mechanics inspected it closely they determined it had a small leak and that the bearings were worn? Not sure how they determined this they just used their hand to turn the pump and said they cold hear the bearings. ? ? Anyway after all was put back together we went for a test drive. Driving around town the temp gauge stayed at around 1/3 - below 1/2 Yeah! ! . This was a short drive less than 10 miles around the flat areas in town. I said I wanted to test it on a hill. There is a small incline taking a road west. So we started on this road and as the incline increased so did the temperature. Bummer . We turned around just before the red line and the temperature went down very quickly. Much faster then before. Mechanic is stumped. On the way home I took the freeway and noticed the same increase in temperature at over 60 mph. Cooled right down when I got off the freeway, took it for a drive up the hill by my home. This is a steep up hill drive. Heat went up as we went up the hill, came down as we came down the hill. I think there is some sort of coolant restriction. I bought a "Toyota" thermostat and plan to take the truck to a radiator shop on Monday. I want to have the system flushed and to have the new "Toyota" thermostat installed and to have the coolant replaced in a manner to insure there are no air bubbles. I will also have the coolant system pressure checked again. Had the ignition timing checked again and it is still good. However: the mechanic with his head under the hood said that he thinks there may be an exhaust leak or vacuum leak? Opinions please. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jjrbus Posted September 20, 2015 Share Posted September 20, 2015 Darn, I was hoping for a great big collective sigh of relief! The only thing I can offer is trying some of the other Toyota truck forums, that is what I would be doing. The Yota forum has a large base of knowledge and experience. http://www.yotatech.com/f116/ This is a link to the 86-95 Yota toyota truck forum, many over there with a lot of knowledge and expericence, tell them your problem and what you have done. HTH Jim Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zero Posted September 20, 2015 Share Posted September 20, 2015 Hi everyone following this thread. Friday the new AISIN water pump was installed. There is a small incline taking a road west. So we started on this road and as the incline increased so did the temperature. BummerI. bought a "Toyota" thermostat and plan to take the truck to a radiator shop on Monday. the mechanic with his head under the hood said that he thinks there may be an exhaust leak or vacuum leak? Opinions please. Toyota DID have a problem with thermostats and had to have one special designed to cure the problem. That, as I recall, is only for the 22RE though. You might want to double check. I doubt flushing will do anything. The chemicals that are used now adays for engine flushing are kind of a joke and pretty benign. One silly question - you are SURE it has a 50/50 mix of antifreeze and water and NOT pure antifreeze - correct? I ask because an engine will run hot with pure antifreeze. My best guess - going by what you've written so far is combustion gasses forcing their way into the coolant under a load (like when hill climbing). The CO tests for coolant are known to be very inaccurate. That would be caused by a bad head gasket, cracked head, etc. The 3 liter and 3.4 liter V6s are known for this type of problem. Toyota's fix is a new type head-gasket that is surface lubricated to allow movement between the head and block. Why they cannot come up with a setup that lasts on those engines is beyond me. There are many other makes of engines out there with iron blocks and aluminum heads that never need new head gaskets. Anyway - that is just a guess. If it was mine - I suspect I'd try everything you mentioned and if no success - I'd pull the heads off and look inside. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shibs Posted September 21, 2015 Share Posted September 21, 2015 Hi everyone following this thread. Friday the new AISIN water pump was installed. I also had the new AISIN timing belt installed. The old water pump looked pretty good when it was removed. When the mechanics inspected it closely they determined it had a small leak and that the bearings were worn? Not sure how they determined this they just used their hand to turn the pump and said they cold hear the bearings. ? ? Anyway after all was put back together we went for a test drive. Driving around town the temp gauge stayed at around 1/3 - below 1/2 Yeah! ! . This was a short drive less than 10 miles around the flat areas in town. I said I wanted to test it on a hill. There is a small incline taking a road west. So we started on this road and as the incline increased so did the temperature. Bummer . We turned around just before the red line and the temperature went down very quickly. Much faster then before. Mechanic is stumped. On the way home I took the freeway and noticed the same increase in temperature at over 60 mph. Cooled right down when I got off the freeway, took it for a drive up the hill by my home. This is a steep up hill drive. Heat went up as we went up the hill, came down as we came down the hill. I think there is some sort of coolant restriction. I bought a "Toyota" thermostat and plan to take the truck to a radiator shop on Monday. I want to have the system flushed and to have the new "Toyota" thermostat installed and to have the coolant replaced in a manner to insure there are no air bubbles. I will also have the coolant system pressure checked again. Had the ignition timing checked again and it is still good. However: the mechanic with his head under the hood said that he thinks there may be an exhaust leak or vacuum leak? Opinions please. Sherrie, take a peek at this pls: http://www.yotatech.com/f116/new-thermostat-waterpump-radiator-burped-no-flow-254120/ 1. as a control to eliminate the thermostat, how about running it without one and see the problem is repeatable 2. Use your vin and call Toyota and see what history they have on your truck. 3. is there a chance the head gasket was redone and it was not done correctly and could be blocking some ports. 4. what radiator did it have initially? what was the condition of it? 5. Possibly you have gunk in the passages in the block 6. Is the block drain plug easily accessible? if yes, how about looking through it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sherrie Posted September 21, 2015 Author Share Posted September 21, 2015 Thanks for the information, I read the thread and think removal of the head gasket must be next. Maybe these blocked ports is what is happening. I Know that Toyota did not do the HG. But that does not mean that someone else did not do the HG. If the HG is installed incorrectly, that might be why it passes all the tests but still overheats. Thanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sherrie Posted September 22, 2015 Author Share Posted September 22, 2015 Replaced thermostat(s) 4 times (now have a Toyota thermostat installed). Replaced Radiator Cap twice. Replaced Radiator Replaced Radiator hoses. Flushed system twice Removed the Fan and Fan Clutch and replaced with electric fan Removed and reinstalled new Water Pump ( AISIN) New timing belt installed. Pressure checked coolant system no leaks. Combustible gas (blue dye) test - no gas - passed Compression Test 170 on 5 cylinders , 155 on one cylinder Leak down test at 100 psi - no leaks detected. So based on all of this and the above thread - maybe we have improperly installed Head Gaskets from previous owner? So we are going to pull the heads and install new head gaskets. Any recommendations on the head gasket kit we should get? Here is a short video of my last test drive FYI. https://youtu.be/QbFG2uZ_3CA Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jjrbus Posted September 22, 2015 Share Posted September 22, 2015 Not a mechanic, but if the head gasket was improperly installed I would think it would overheat all the time, not just going up hill. Linda S just posted the recall info. You can check and see if your vin is here. you might be eligible for a free head gasket job. Don't know if you checked that yet? http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=1&ved=0CEkQFjAA&url=http%3A%2F%2Ftoyotamotorhome.org%2Fforums%2Findex.php%3Fapp%3Dcore%26module%3Dattach%26section%3Dattach%26attach_id%3D3864&ei=pw0RUpfOBoagigLxtIDwCg&usg=AFQjCNEO5ZfE87ouQz6YEr8jnd6fX_0IRg&sig2=ou-jBMVhUlCd3_VgILtC3A It is claimed there is no expiration on the recall. On the side I loved Mt Charleston and Red Rock canyon when I was a kid, very fond memories of Vegas when I lived there. Jim SW FL Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WME Posted September 22, 2015 Share Posted September 22, 2015 The bottom radiator hose should be VERY stiff when cold or have a big coil spring inside. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sherrie Posted September 22, 2015 Author Share Posted September 22, 2015 HEAD GASKET REPLACEMENT VIA THE SPECIAL SERVICE CAMPAIGN So I printed out the Head Gasket Recall Info that Linda Provided (thank you) And my vin number matches the SSC So I called Toyota Corp and they said just take it in to the local dealer I have an appointment tomowarrow at 12:00 noon for a Head Gasket Replacement. Wonder what will happen. PS. I did call prior to all of this and they said there had not been any prior HG replacement done. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shibs Posted September 22, 2015 Share Posted September 22, 2015 HEAD GASKET REPLACEMENT VIA THE SPECIAL SERVICE CAMPAIGN So I printed out the Head Gasket Recall Info that Linda Provided (thank you) And my vin number matches the SSC So I called Toyota Corp and they said just take it in to the local dealer I have an appointment tomowarrow at 12:00 noon for a Head Gasket Replacement. Wonder what will happen. PS. I did call prior to all of this and they said there had not been any prior HG replacement done. if they do it, pls ask them to take pics of the open head, ask them to inspect the coolant ports.... good luck! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zero Posted September 22, 2015 Share Posted September 22, 2015 Sounds like a great deal if it all works out. I've heard that Toyota even replaced a few engines under that head-gasket "campaign" because of damage from the leaking head gasket. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sherrie Posted September 22, 2015 Author Share Posted September 22, 2015 The bottom radiator hose should be VERY stiff when cold or have a big coil spring inside. Yes it is very stiff Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shibs Posted September 22, 2015 Share Posted September 22, 2015 yeap Toyota is good about it, after I bought my 90 v6, I called them with the vin, they said bring it over to do the head gasket if the recall was not done, they checked and called back and said it was already :-) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mtdave2 Posted September 23, 2015 Share Posted September 23, 2015 Wow, you have as much trouble as I usually do! Hope you get this figured out. Since all the normal stuff has been suggested, I have one that may be the problem. Hook up a code scanner to the truck and take a look at your fuel trim numbers. Ecu can go bad, O2 sensors can lie, and several other things can cause the ecu to lean out your fuel mixture. Lean =hot. Good luck! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sherrie Posted September 23, 2015 Author Share Posted September 23, 2015 Wow, you have as much trouble as I usually do! Hope you get this figured out. Since all the normal stuff has been suggested, I have one that may be the problem. Hook up a code scanner to the truck and take a look at your fuel trim numbers. Ecu can go bad, O2 sensors can lie, and several other things can cause the ecu to lean out your fuel mixture. Lean =hot. Good luck! Thanks for the info on the ECU. I will check this out! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sherrie Posted September 23, 2015 Author Share Posted September 23, 2015 Today I took the Toyota to the Toyota Dealer with the paperwork in hand regarding the Special Service Campaign and they agreed to do the Head Gasket! Yeah! I hope this resolves the issue! They said anywhere from a week to two weeks! I will let you know - when I get it back. Thanks everyone for your help and support! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mtdave2 Posted September 24, 2015 Share Posted September 24, 2015 Sherrie, it is a far out the normal issue but it does happen. More than likely it is your head gasket. Guess we will see! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sherrie Posted September 29, 2015 Author Share Posted September 29, 2015 So I got a call from the dealer ship service department, (doing the Head Gasket) they wanted to know if we wanted to do the valve seals? I said that I had read there was a "Valve Adjustment" and they said that would be included in replacing the Valve Seals. Cost $550.00. Opinions Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vanman Posted September 29, 2015 Share Posted September 29, 2015 At that mileage replacing exhaust shims not due yet, but if you have it done now no worries for many thousand miles after. Don't know about the seals but it sure makes sense if you tear it down that far to put all new seals in. If you are gonna put many miles on it you might well consider doing it now. That price would be good around here, but might be high considering they will have the heads off anyway to do the gaskets. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shibs Posted September 29, 2015 Share Posted September 29, 2015 blue smoke, did the engine burn oil? I would do it if the dealer comes off the price. ask them to throw you a bone, as they are already opening up the head have them take off some labor. They are going by the repair book. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sherrie Posted September 29, 2015 Author Share Posted September 29, 2015 blue smoke, did the engine burn oil? I would do it if the dealer comes off the price. ask them to throw you a bone, as they are already opening up the head have them take off some labor. They are going by the repair book. No smoke, no burning oil - I will ask for price break. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zero Posted September 29, 2015 Share Posted September 29, 2015 So I got a call from the dealer ship service department, (doing the Head Gasket) they wanted to know if we wanted to do the valve seals? I said that I had read there was a "Valve Adjustment" and they said that would be included in replacing the Valve Seals. Cost $550.00. Opinions I think $550 to install new valve seals is insane! Good lord - the heads are going to be off anyway. You're talking not even $20 in parts. Where to these places dream up these repair costs? It shouldn't cost much more then that to do a complete valve job with new guides, seals, exhaust valves, etc. Something does not sound right. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zero Posted September 29, 2015 Share Posted September 29, 2015 Do you have an automotive machine shop in your area? If so, you might want to call them and get a price quote of JUST replacing your valve seals. It's $20-$25 in parts and maybe three hours labor if they are slow. It is possible they will refuse to do it and only have an "all or nothing" policy. That is, complete valve job or nothing. But if you explain your situation (engine runs fine) - they might give you a price. I still say the price you got is absurd. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
linda s Posted September 30, 2015 Share Posted September 30, 2015 I would just ask them to itemize the parts and labor for the $550 valve seal job. My guess is they are charging you twice to remove the heads. That would be illegal in most states. Auto dealers have rules and regulations they have to abide by. Linda S Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zero Posted September 30, 2015 Share Posted September 30, 2015 The heads don't have to be removed to replace just the valve-stem seals. But since the heads will be off anyway - it just makes the job that much easier. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sherrie Posted September 30, 2015 Author Share Posted September 30, 2015 I think I will go over there tomorrow morning and have a talk with them. Maybe they have the heads off and I can take some pictures. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shibs Posted September 30, 2015 Share Posted September 30, 2015 they have this repair book that tell them the labor time for the job by itself. ask them to charge you the incremental labor for just the valve seal job. I think you can buy a NEW head for that much :-) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sherrie Posted October 2, 2015 Author Share Posted October 2, 2015 I Have the Winnie Back! I did a couple of quick trips - one short up to Mt. Charleston and another up to the Decature shooting range my two favorite Overheating test drives and it did NOT OVERHEAT!. I will have to wait for the week end before I can do more of a test drive. It did cost me $701.00 but I will review the bill more closely and see if there are some charges I can dispute. Of course I could not see or talk to the Tech that worked on her - but she just purrrs! So happy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jjrbus Posted October 2, 2015 Share Posted October 2, 2015 Congratulations, it is about time! Just a thought, scan and post the bill here. Some of our members are pretty sharp and might have some suggestions on what and how to dispute. Jim Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shibs Posted October 2, 2015 Share Posted October 2, 2015 Congrat, pls share the total $$ and time it took to get this fixed. Yes, post the bill and we probably pick through it so at the end Toyota will end up owing you $$$ ;-) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sherrie Posted October 3, 2015 Author Share Posted October 3, 2015 Here are the Repair Bills. Page 1 & 2 are for Spark Plug Wires and Valve Seals, Page 3 & 4 are for the HG Replacement covered by Toyota Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shibs Posted October 5, 2015 Share Posted October 5, 2015 Sherrie, the images have been resized to 400x and the text of the receipt is hard to read. Could you please load the raw images to imgur.com and post the links pls. Thanks, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zero Posted October 5, 2015 Share Posted October 5, 2015 I can read the bills okay. The charge looks ridiculous and okay to me. Ridiculous for the high cost but okay because you approved it. I'm not picking on you. Just something I'd never personally pay. It's your money and your RV. $104.50 for a set of plug wires is very high but you did ask for them. So is $112 for twelve valve seals that cost around $2 each from non-dealer sellers. $440 labor is VERY excessive in my world for just putting in valve seals. But hey, maybe they are charging $200 an hour like a lawyer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sherrie Posted October 5, 2015 Author Share Posted October 5, 2015 Sherrie, the images have been resized to 400x and the text of the receipt is hard to read. Could you please load the raw images to imgur.com and post the links pls. Thanks, Here is a link to see the bill on imgur http://imgur.com/a/ccKwY http://imgur.com/a/ccKwY Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sherrie Posted October 5, 2015 Author Share Posted October 5, 2015 So Sad , took the Winnie out for a longer test drive and it overheated! Going back to the dealer this morning, Hopefully it's nothing to bad. left the dealer at mileage 51660, overheat at mileage 51717. (57 miles) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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