Full LED toy home

[Maineah]

no kidding that was the most ridiculous thing i have heard i ran it by my friend who is an electrical engineering student in case there was something i missed.

Just going to let it die, I will say out loud theres a whole telephone game of ignorance that sometimes goes off in a forum. I want to cut that one out early, and obviously. Thats some crazy bs dont listen to it and watch the names it came from, like some free form babble and the next person took it on like it made sense.

in 12 volt audio systems there are step up parts for 12-24 volts and some for each level ( 14 16 18 20) comes in all car stereo installation equipment. That is the apprentice electrician work there, dc power.

thats the opposite of what I think a forum is for. This is the age of the end of bs.

Other than that everyone have a nice day. ;o)

all consumer dc batteries put out 1.5 volts. put them together and they make 3 volts.

I can show you the inside of any rechargeable battery, they all end with a capacitor that raises the dc up from the last cell.

all dc power. put in a capacitor( a battery is a capacitor) dc voltage goes up. put in a resistor and it goes down. you can look it up, but if you disagree dont post here im not listening to it or putting up with it. This is not the type of conversation you need to be part of.

this is a project searching for the direct links to buy things and if you dont have those you dont belong here relating your electrical training it just might waste my time if i believe it. I still love you though.

what if you had 12 volts.... and then you put it in serial to 2 aa batteries.... what would you have? 15 volts!!!!!!!! except you dont need the whole battery just the wire front to back to be in serial.

if you dont understand thats fine dont ask questions, dont interject you are going to be a reading only participant in these two little projects im working on.

This is a picture of a dc/dc converter it presently is adjusted to produce 19 volts DC from 12 volts DC. It is not a simple device with a few wires and capacitors. A capacitor will store nothing more than what is put in it 12 volts in 12 volts out it cannot spontaneously produce electricity. They can be used for very short term enhancement of current. True you can string a load of batteries together and produce hundreds of volts if you want but then what are you going to do with all that voltage? A transformer will not work on DC they are based on the principle of mutual inductance if you put 12 volt DC in you get nothing out the other side, get out your volt meter and try it. After 52 years of letting the smoke out of electronic parts before I retired I have learned a few things. Experimentation is a good thing this how technology progress it is however a good ideal to at least have a bit of basic knowledge first.

[Totem]

This is a picture of a dc/dc converter it presently is adjusted to produce 19 volts DC from 12 volts DC. It is not a simple device with a few wires and capacitors. A capacitor will store nothing more than what is put in it 12 volts in 12 volts out it cannot spontaneously produce electricity. They can be used for very short term enhancement of current. True you can string a load of batteries together and produce hundreds of volts if you want but then what are you going to do with all that voltage? A transformer will not work on DC they are based on the principle of mutual inductance if you put 12 volt DC in you get nothing out the other side, get out your volt meter and try it. After 52 years of letting the smoke out of electronic parts before I retired I have learned a few things. Experimentation is a good thing this how technology progress it is however a good ideal to at least have a bit of basic knowledge first.

The "wires" coil around the ceramic circle is called an inductor. this will store energy in a magnetic field. There are also several capacitors in this small build.

stepping up voltage is no big deal; you will increase voltage and decrease current inversely. The difference being the Delta. Now had he said that its impossible to step up voltage AND current I would agree, not ad infinitum.

Electricity should be thought of like Water Maineah, you can take a small hose and fill a a swimming pool. then you can open a massive drain at the bottom of the pool. When measured at that time the flow of water out of the pool will have a higher volume. now if we took that pool of water and put it in a closed plastic sphere and then pressurized it we could increase the pressure of the stream of water. Ultimately though it will only have so much water in it and will run out. That's when the red light comes on and the device stops. of course if you are putting one cup in the pool and taking one cup out but shooting it through a squirt gun you will get 1 cup out at a much higher pressure. It can do that infinitely. the volume of the stream is of course reduce but its pressure increases. Im not sure I like your statement on the capacitor either because of this. Storing energy in magnetic fields or in electric fields always allows room to play with current and voltage and frequency. That's how these things work; its the same way an inverter works.

[Maineah]

Yes the toroid stores current but there is an oscillator involved it must collapse in order to release its stored energy otherwise it would just sit there. Here’s a simple one. Capacitors if you look carefully are voltage rated beyond their rated voltage they will arc rendering them useless they are built to that standard and used it the circuit accordingly. All though there are many types and uses of capacitors they all have voltage limitations. Capacitors are often used as a low impedance by pass for high freq.

[stamar]

I am positive I do not want to hear anyones theories on dc conversion. None of that thanks.

It iis extremely common, cheap and obtainable. That's the end of that story.

[waiter]

Mainneas circuit is a regular ole AC inverter with a built in DC power supply hanging on the end, basically, its an electronic switch. that turns L! on and off real fast. i.e. I think I seen this one was 300,000 times a second. ( For those that have experience with an AC Autotransformer, i.e. a single coil transfer where the primary also acts as the secondary), that what L1 does)

you turn on the switch (Q1) and charge the capacitior C3 through coil L!.

After the coil L1 has reached saturation (The magnetic field builds up to max), you turn it off, the magnetic field now collapses and induces a voltage into the wires, you take this voltage, rectify it to remove the AC component, and charge the capacitor C3 to the voltage thats produced from the L1 magnetic collapse..

C3 acts as a filter and a mini battery, as it stores the charge while while L1 is turned on and off.

Regulation of the output voltage is accomplished by controlling the length of time the L1 coil is allowed to conduct/break down.

John Mc

88 Dolphin 4 Auto

[Totem]

Yep; frequency. Phase Shift

[Maineah]

I am positive I do not want to hear anyones theories on dc conversion. None of that thanks.

It iis extremely common, cheap and obtainable. That's the end of that story.

And your point is?

[stamar]

Ha

My point is that life is a million times better with 4 led lights in the coach. Before I would kill the battery if I left them on and fell asleep.

The illumination reaches farther and the cooler colors make things so much more visible.

I got one of each cool white and warm white. I think you can't go wrong with all warm white but the variety is perfect too. Cool white is brighter you see more.

I am shoppping for all of the bulbs outside on the coach

I'm going with the same company unless someone has a direct link to cheaper. There are ten.

[stamar]

http://www.ebay.com/itm/10X-T10-194-168-501-921-W5W-12-LED-3020-SMD-Car-Side-Wedge-Light-Bulb-Lamp-White-/261083668856?_trksid=p3984.m2045&_trkparms=aid%3D333005%26algo%3DRIC.FIT%26ao%3D1%26asc%3D30%26meid%3D3408068322692611596%26pid%3D100018%26prg%3D1023%26rk%3D3%26sd%3D221110458511%26

I went for these.i could only save 4$ ordering from china, so they made a compelling point.

and whereas the last time i ordered from china, my leds came in 6 days, this is already day 12 for the 2nd order i made, so shipping from china is very spotty.

there are exactly 10 wedge lights outside on my dolphin and these are sold in packs of ten.

I honestly dont think they are that important but i bet they use a lot of juice. 10 of them no less.

none of mine are burned out either yet.

[Totem]

couple questions, by wedge lights you mean outdoor marker lights right?

what is the mounting plan, solder?

[waiter]

They look like replacements for standard 194 bulbs.

keep in mind that the marker lights are two colors, red and amber. The white LEDs may not put out enough color (red and amber) to be satisfactory.

Keep us posted on how these work out.

John Mc

88 Dolphin 4 Auto

[stamar]

i haven't ordered them. i wont if there's something wrong with them

as far as actually ordering i ordered my 50 smd overhead lights 2 weeks ago and am still waiting. just shopping.

ya I'm not ordering anything that doesn't work.

i mean the outside lights.on the top

they are all in orange plastic.

[Totem]

They look like replacements for standard 194 bulbs.

keep in mind that the marker lights are two colors, red and amber. The white LEDs may not put out enough color (red and amber) to be satisfactory.

Keep us posted on how these work out.

John Mc

88 Dolphin 4 Auto

interesting... so these would be a drop in for a warning light in the dash then. got it.

I bet they are 10 x brighter than the current marker bulbs. Mine are so dim they are barely bright at all and SMDs are BRIGHT...

[stamar]

that was the bulb that was in my stoves overhead.

[stamar]

if you have the bulb number for all of the lights on a dolphin dont keep it a secret.

[waiter]

194's are common for automotive instrument lights, and marker lights.

I don't think the e-bay LED bulbs Stamar linked to would work in an instrument panel, as they look to be physically to large. I don't think they'll work as markers either, as they probably don't emit enough of the correct color. i.e. Front top markers should be amber, rear top markers should be red.

TOTEM, Check and see how much dust and dirt are on your existing bulbs and lenses

PPL has a chart on their web site that lists common RV bulbs. PPL BULB CHART.

I converted most of my bulbs to LEDs, As someone pointed out earlier, often its cheaper to conserve power than it is to add power generation capacity. Heres a couple links to my conversions to give readers some ideas of what I did.

RUNNING LIGHT LED CONVERSION

TAIL LIGHT LED CONVERSION

INTERIOR LED CONVERSION

In all these cases, I chose to eliminate the socket, as its generally a source of problems, and isn't needed if the bulb will never be replaced.

John Mc

88 Dolphin 4 Auto

[Totem]

at least on my rig anyway; its markers are all BARGMAN 99's so color would definately not be an issue as the light shines through a very deeply colored lens. The bulbs are clear tiny flashlight bulbs with a metal base.

Its funny you mention cleaning them; I just got done doing just that. the Bargmans were all pretty clean other than the contact points corroded so I nail filed them and got out the electricians grease... the only ones that had severely coated bulbs and lenses were my rear tail lights. It seems they filled with dust and a very fine silt; and that the silt clogged the drain away so I made sure to clean that also. If I were to try these I would solder them to the Bargman mounts also.

[waiter]

Totem, Color is a problem because of the lens. i.e., If you have a green LED and try and shine it thru a red lens, you see nothing

The White LEDs put out very narrow band of colors (red, green, blue) to come up with white, A bulb puts out a very wide spectrum of light to come up with the warm white.

Since the LEDs Red color is the only color that can get thru the RED lens, it will be approx 1/3rd as bright, This problem is the same for the amber light.

You would be better to get a RED LED for the red lights and an AMBER LED for the amber lights. this way, almost all the light produced by the LED can get thru the lens.

John Mc

88 DOlphin 4 Auto

[Totem]

I have a white SMD panel shining through my amber lensed porch light; it works just fine... I dont understand your comment. yellow and blue makes green I get that; but we are talking white SMDs here...

[waiter]

The three primary colors are Red, Green and Blue. To get white, you need those three primaries. A White LED will work just fine and will produce RED and YELLOW.

However, If all you need is RED, then why waste energy producing the green and blue.

Also, If all you want is Yellow, then all you need is Red and Green, so don't waste energy producing the blue.

If your into radio spectrum frequency analysis, this chart may help you see what happens with white LEDs vs single color LEDs>

Color Emission Chart

John Mc

88 Dolphin 4 Auto

[stamar]

Btw I'm not interested in any soldering or altering of sockets I won't be doing that.

Id rather have direct links to al the external lights before I get them.

If they are amber then amber ones.

[stamar]

ive found tons of 1157 bulbs on ebay china.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/TOYOTA-1157-1154-2057-BAY15D-18-SMD-5050-LED-Brake-Tail-Turn-Signal-Light-RED-/190752788129?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item2c69c08ea1

I just dont have a verify from anyone that they work

what is the name of the 5 wedge amber bulbs in front and the 5 wedge red bulbs for the back?

[stamar]

theres something wrong here.

the bulbs are all halogen white bulbs under plastic.

replacing just the bulb should work

[stamar]

theres something thats just batsh@t crazy here.

even a red led is just a white led with colored lens over each element. like the warm white leds just have some yellow plastic over the exact same white white ones.

I guarantee that not only will putting a white bulb behind the red plastic thats already there put out the same amount of light as putting a red bulb behind red plastic

it will actually put more light out. it may make it appear closer to pink than red but because were putting in actual white bulbs where incadescent bulbs are yellow.

all that is just entirely incorrect to this project Im sorry.

putting a red bulb behind red plastic will make it deeper red, and less bright.;

Im looking at white bulbs, im replaciong them with white leds. for a fraction of the cost. not buying new squares for it or anything.

and i got the bulbs right.

[stamar]

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Red-1pc-24-LED-Car-Stop-Parking-Lamp-Tail-Brake-Light-Rear-Turn-Signal-Bulb-1157-/181012787435?pt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&hash=item2a2533f0eb&vxp=mtr

for lack of a better idea im actually going to get red and white,

and make a color difference in the brake and tail lights where there wasnt one before.

[waiter]

even a red led is just a white led with colored lens over each element.

Not so. generally, a red LED emits only red light, there is no colored lens.

Heres a very good article that explains white LEDs and single color LEDs.

https://led-brdf.wik...duction to LEDs

In the article they talked about the technology improvements. In 1980, I was working on experimental blue laser communications systems for submarines. When building a test fixture , I needed a narrowband blue light source. We found Seimans was experimenting with blue LEDs, and we were able to purchase 6 of them for about $100 each. Today I can get them by the thousand for penny's each.

John Mc

88 Dolphin 4 Auto

[stamar]

you can clearly see the level of yellow plastic on each led in warm white

whereas on the cool white ones theres a thinner layer of blue plastic on each element.

clearly visible in the pictures i took of them

however i will conceed the actual effeciency of light because its irrellevant to this project.

I can get all 10 bulbs for 10$ for what you are calling the running lights, and it will use less power and needs no fabrication. im pretty sure it will be much brighter than stock but if it isnt ill live because these running lights arent that important.

[waiter]

Keep us posted on your findings.

John Mc

88 Dolphin 4 Auto

[Totem]

Again as mentioned I have already debunked this LED "color" rumor. I have a cool white SMD 20 LED panel in my rigs porch light. The porch light came with two filter lenses, one amber one and one clear. I chose the Amber because it made the light warmer and less "cat vomit" like. It lights up .... drum role please.... AMBER. Not green, not violet, but amber. To Stamars point getting white LEDs would be a safe swap out in any colored lens application. This is my finding and I'm sticking to it. Also, I soldered the SMD stick on panel to the former Bulb housing.

Now to really shake up the thread, and to Waiters point I have a really nice "mood" LED that plugs into the map light of my cab. It changes colors every few moments.. and its plastic is clear. the light eminating from it when observed very closely is clearly comming from 3 seperate diodes of the primary colors. They come on and fade out in differing patterns creating the illusion of secondary color changes.

[stamar]

yes to reiterate what i have said earlier, and now after reading about it....

Totem and I are absolutely correct and waiter is very mistaken. but loved nonetheless and I now am fully educated about bulbs in fixtures as opposed to being uncertain before.

Get white bulbs for your fixtures. dont get red ones for red fixtures.

the difference in led color is created by a colored lens on top of the led.

the red blue green led concept has nothing at all to do with the lights we are putting on our car, which are all 100% white leds.

[Totem]

the small incandescent bulbs in my marker lights, I call them "flashlight bulbs" I wonder if there is an LED swapout for those...

I'll have to check one for its number

[waiter]

Totem, Stamar, please review the article I posted. and you'll discover that what I have been telling you is indeed correct.

https://led-brdf.wikispaces.com/Introduction+to+LEDs

There are two ways of coming up with white LEDs. One method is three separate leds (as Totem observed) and the other is a chemical reaction that is doped in the LED,

The Three LED method is very narrow band as can be seen on the wavelength charts, where as the chemical doping is more broadband.

Yes, you can use a white LED (doped broadband type) and use a red or amber lens to block all color except the color you want.

However, As I mentioned, it would be more efficient to use a single color LED if your attempting to get RED or AMBER.

Keep us posted on your findings as they are of interest to others that read these threads.

John Mc

88 Dolphin 4 Auto

[stamar]

effecient how? using less power?

the problem with these theories is these different types of leds are not what are for sale in auto parts.

they are all white, and there is no purpose to getting red ones because they are also white with a red lens.

[Totem]

Unsure on regular ol school style LEDs, they wouldnt be bright enough for me to consider using anyway; +

SMD type diodes, in cool white as mentioned shine through just fine. These are what I would use rather than the 30 LED shoved into a light bulb balist approach sold by automotive. The wedge SMDs showed promise; I will try those in cool white. Cool white SMD has the most output.

[stamar]

http://www.ebay.com/...d=221110458511

you mean these?

well the main reason for these is they ship fast. im going on 2 weeks from china. they cost about 40c more per light and you have to buy 10, but by coincidence i need 10

do not get these in red or amber thats confusing two concepts. get white leds for your fixtures.

actually cool white doesnt have the most output.

just regular white does.

these auto parts seem to sell warm white and cool white, which is a slightly blue white which is 6000k

but real white is 5000k, that is the brightest.

later today im going to eyesight test the two colors which are 3300 and 6000 to see which reveals more.

im opinion they have a similar output.