mikescadillac Posted August 26, 2012 Share Posted August 26, 2012 Good day all!! I recently purchaced a 1985 "New Horizons" Toyota 21' Motor Home (it was real cheap) after purchacing it I discovered the difference in rear axles, as a Mechanic, I'm always up to a challenge, (maybe a chevy 350 in place of the 22R?) since there are very few of these toyota's up here in Canada, and the thoughts of finding a full floater up here are very remote, is there anyone here who has put a "non-toyota" rear axle in these trucks? I have done a little research and found that a Chevy S10 axle is very close in physical size to the original, I havn't compared bearing sizes yet, but I think it could be a viable swap using an 8 ply single tire on a wider 15" wheel. Any thoughts out there??? I'm on the road a lot, so I may not get internet when I need it. (the U.S. has a different idea of a strong signal for internet!) thanks for any and all info, I look forward to reading all the posts on the forum Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
linda s Posted August 26, 2012 Share Posted August 26, 2012 Good day all!! I recently purchaced a 1985 "New Horizons" Toyota 21' Motor Home (it was real cheap) after purchacing it I discovered the difference in rear axles, as a Mechanic, I'm always up to a challenge, (maybe a chevy 350 in place of the 22R?) since there are very few of these toyota's up here in Canada, and the thoughts of finding a full floater up here are very remote, is there anyone here who has put a "non-toyota" rear axle in these trucks? I have done a little research and found that a Chevy S10 axle is very close in physical size to the original, I havn't compared bearing sizes yet, but I think it could be a viable swap using an 8 ply single tire on a wider 15" wheel. Any thoughts out there??? I'm on the road a lot, so I may not get internet when I need it. (the U.S. has a different idea of a strong signal for internet!) thanks for any and all info, I look forward to reading all the posts on the forum Mike Chevy s10 motorhomes had axle problems too. Another possible alternative is an axle out of a v6 toyota truck 1989 to 1993 with single wheels. These were the same heavier duty axles used on the very few turbo's made. They were used on the v6 Odyssey 4x4's with no alterations with single wheels and seem to hold up well. And yes definately upgrade to 15 inch wheels so you can buy tires with enough weight rating. If you can find it a Dana 60 will work to but you might have to shorten the axle shafts depending on what it was installed on before. Linda S Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
linda s Posted August 26, 2012 Share Posted August 26, 2012 Or you could take a lovely drive to this place and pick up the real thing. Toyota full floater that is. Only 3 hours and a border away. Trust me people have gone farther. According to car-part.com they have one but be sure and check first. You will need the wheels that go with it. Your duallies won't fit http://www.mynationwideautoparts.com/ This is in Toledo Oh Linda S Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikescadillac Posted August 26, 2012 Author Share Posted August 26, 2012 thanks Linda, I'm through Toledo quite often, I'm across the river from Detroit, will give these people a call, might be hard to get my semi through but I will make it down there eventually Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davidadro Posted August 27, 2012 Share Posted August 27, 2012 All of us dread the possibility of seeking out the dreaded rear axle dilemma, They are just not plentiful, and when one comes available, well they are snatched up quickly. An old U-haul Toyota box bed is a place maybe, but you get the whole truck to deal with thereafter. I do wish you all the luck in the world, and hope one comes your way. There are many posts around the internet about using the 5.0 302 for V8 swaps, as it seems to fit real good in the Yota's engine bay. Here are some motor mounts, so they are available for a job of this nature: http://www.summitrac...sc&autoview=SKU It would be an interesting concept, and plenty of needed power, but a project one would have to have the tools, time, and expertise! Let us know if you attempt something like this, and give photos do, that would be awesome! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek up North Posted August 27, 2012 Share Posted August 27, 2012 I'm across the river from Detroit, ... Windsor? I'm ex-Tecumseh/Riverside myself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikescadillac Posted August 30, 2012 Author Share Posted August 30, 2012 thank you all!! as far as that 4 letter "F" word, I'm strictly a Chev man, to Derek Up North, I live in St. Thomas, but truck out of Windsor, mostly the east coast Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek up North Posted August 30, 2012 Share Posted August 30, 2012 Well you'll have to wave next time you're on your way 'down East'. I'm in Montreal now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikescadillac Posted September 14, 2012 Author Share Posted September 14, 2012 Hello all!! I'm going to install a Range Rover rear end, its longer, but with the style of wheel offset it should all tuck in there quite nice, anyone know if the front torsion bars interchange with the 4runner 4x4?? haven't checked yet, just thought I would throw it out there thanks Mike I will keep you all posted on my rear end!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikescadillac Posted October 29, 2012 Author Share Posted October 29, 2012 Hello All! Range Rover rear end swap didn't happen, the guy I was going to get it from changed his mind about parting out the vehicle. have a 4 runner axle that will be going in instead, I'm trying to find out if there is an interchange where I can use the 6 stud hubs, rotors & calipers in place of the 5 stud currently on the truck???? searching the internet has been fruitless, any idea's?? Once again, thanks for your wealth of information!! Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
linda s Posted October 29, 2012 Share Posted October 29, 2012 Hello All! Range Rover rear end swap didn't happen, the guy I was going to get it from changed his mind about parting out the vehicle. have a 4 runner axle that will be going in instead, I'm trying to find out if there is an interchange where I can use the 6 stud hubs, rotors & calipers in place of the 5 stud currently on the truck???? searching the internet has been fruitless, any idea's?? Once again, thanks for your wealth of information!! Mike The 4 runner axle should already have a 6 lug hub. Is it out of a v6 or older 4 banger. The v6 axle is stronger. The 4 banger would not be an upgrade. The 6 lug full floater hub will not fit on anything but a full floater axle. Linda S Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikescadillac Posted October 29, 2012 Author Share Posted October 29, 2012 sorry, I forgot to mention its the front brakes I'm working on, the rear axle is out of a '90 4-runner, and I want to replace the FRONT 5 stud hubs & related parts with 6 stud hubs & related parts. I heard somewhere there was an interchange for the front brakes from a different model truck but I can't recall where I heard it from (old age catching up with me!!!) thanks Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
linda s Posted October 30, 2012 Share Posted October 30, 2012 It's a lot of work and money for not much difference. My Sunrader is an 86 and they all came with 5 lug front and 6 lug full floating back. I don't carry a spare for the rear cause I can drive the duallies a long way with one tire on that side if needed. In your case I would just get an adapter to use if you get a flat so your spare will fit where needed Linda S Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek up North Posted October 30, 2012 Share Posted October 30, 2012 I'm not sure he's going to find an off the shelf adapter for his combination of bolt circles. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
linda s Posted October 30, 2012 Share Posted October 30, 2012 I'm not sure he's going to find an off the shelf adapter for his combination of bolt circles. I found quite a lot of them but this is the only one I found with the right stud size. http://www.ebay.com/itm/6x139-7-5x114-3-Wheel-1-75-Billet-2-Rim-Adapters-/160571223048#vi-content Extra wheel well room in the back because of no duallies would seem to be the right place to use adapters Linda S Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maineah Posted October 30, 2012 Share Posted October 30, 2012 I think the later 4 runners had coil springs might involve welding. You might check wheel bearings for both rears (4 and 6) I think they are the same. No matter what Toyota pickup rear you use it's still a 1/2 ton axle 6 bolts or not unless it's a full floater. Later front hubs with the 6 bolt set up had larger rotors etc. and were not bolted together it was a complete casting. Using spacers on a single bearing axle will increase the loading on the all ready stressed hub. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Totem Posted October 30, 2012 Share Posted October 30, 2012 this is gonna be an interesting situation. 21 footer will have a lot of weight... i would bite the bullet and have the proper full floater shipped. can have them send the hubs too and 7 wheels. if you are gonna do it, do it right. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bunneys Posted October 30, 2012 Share Posted October 30, 2012 I agree with Maineah, The 4Runner axle is the same. You will need the Full Floating axle to take the weight off the axle shafts. You can use a full floater from a Toyota Landcruiser if you can find one and like to be different, but I'd just go with the Toyota truck one personally. Another possible alternative is an axle out of a v6 toyota truck 1989 to 1993 with single wheels. These were the same heavier duty axles used on the very few turbo's made. Linda S Linda, I think your talking about the 4 cly/ V6 3rd member design here... The axles are the same, just the V6/Turbo model is a little beefier. It is a 4-pinion design, whereas the regular 8" is a 2-pinion design. This does not help carry the weight in any way. Hope it helps! Andrew. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
linda s Posted October 30, 2012 Share Posted October 30, 2012 The v6 axle carries the weight of the Odyssey 4x4 just fine with single wheels. The adapter is just for flats not the long haul and causes way less offset than that huge fake dually. Short distances should be fine. The big issue here I see is he's going to need a bigger wheel to find a tire to carry it. 15 inch wheels for the 4runner back are easy to find but the pattern on the front is a little harder. I know some people have put 16 inch wheels on a 4x4 but don't know if there is enough clearance on a 2wd. There are suitable stock wheels out there and tires. Just let me know what you plan on using and I will let you know what to look for. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bunneys Posted October 30, 2012 Share Posted October 30, 2012 The v6 axle carries the weight of the Odyssey 4x4 just fine with single wheels. The factory Toyota rear axles are a semi-floating design. In this design, the load is spread over 2 components. One is the wheel bearing, the other is the axle shaft itself. The load taken by the axle shaft then gets transmitted to the carrier bearings inside the differential. These axle shafts are also only held in by the press fit bearing on the axle shaft. When this bearing wears out, there is nothing left to hold the entire assembly to the housing; hence it promptly leaves the vehicle…wheel, axle shaft and all. Should an axle shaft break, the bearing will hold the axle in for a short time, until the wobbling, and twisting force destroys the bearing. Since the wheel bearings were never designed to take a twisting force, the bearing fails shortly after the axle shaft breaks. On a full-floating axle design, the load on the wheel is placed 100% on a pair of wheel bearings. The axle shaft is only used to drive the wheel, not take the weight of the vehicle. If a wheel bearing fails, the wheel does not leave the vehicle because the bearings are tapered roller, and held on by 2 spindle nuts. The wheel/hub assembly can wobble, significantly, and the wheel still will not come off. Also, with the full-floating design, an axle shaft can fail, and will only affect drive to that wheel. Should an axle shaft break, the pieces should be removed, but the hub assembly, bearings and brakes will not be affected. Full-Floater Conversion here: http://frontrangeoff...?products_id=94 But for $669 extra, I'd still suggest finding a used stock toyota C&C 1 ton Full Floating rear axle, and change the front hubs to the 1 ton style to use the same rims... But that is just what i would do. I don't mean to say that is the only way by any means... Just don't over load an axle that can fail and kill people. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maineah Posted October 30, 2012 Share Posted October 30, 2012 The axles flex at the outside of the bearing, the hub snaps off you lose the wheel, brake drum, along with the flange all nice and neatly bolted together. They make an aftermarket heavy duty axle that has a greater radius at the flange that helps but the fact still remains there is only one bearing carrying the entire load. There is no 21 foot Toyota motor home that is light enough for a 1/2 ton axle. The 6 bolt axle on a 1/2 ton will get you a 15 or 16" wheel from a Tacoma but a tire that can carry 2 tons won't help an axle that's good for 1/2 ton. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bunneys Posted October 30, 2012 Share Posted October 30, 2012 this is gonna be an interesting situation. 21 footer will have a lot of weight... i would bite the bullet and have the proper full floater shipped. can have them send the hubs too and 7 wheels. if you are gonna do it, do it right. just going to add your excellent swap thread to this: http://toyotamotorho...?showtopic=4508 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek up North Posted October 30, 2012 Share Posted October 30, 2012 The only hiccup I keep coming back to (ad nauseum) is the 5-lug rear axle* used under the 1-Ton SRW pickup. I'm not saying it'll handle the bending induced by a set of 'foolies', but with a single 15" rim (to allow a single Load Range D tire with enough capacity) it just might do the job. *This all assuming that the 1-Ton SRW axle is not identical to a 1/2-Ton axle. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
linda s Posted October 30, 2012 Share Posted October 30, 2012 In 1990 Toyota sold a 1 ton single wheel truck with a GVWR of 5600lbs. 100lbs more than the GVWR of all the 4 banger toyota motorhomes with a full floater. So with the v6 axle and 100 lbs more weight rating than my Sunrader with the full floater. The deal is here single rear wheels. Derek just posted while I was writing. The v6 axle is also the turbo axle and they came out with it in 1986? Possible that it was used in the 1 ton? Linda S Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek up North Posted October 30, 2012 Share Posted October 30, 2012 The V6 and Turbo are both 4-pinion differentials. I don't know for sure if the axles are the same. I suppose a bit of time on one of those Toyota parts sites where you can look up part numbers using the VIN might provide some answers. Anyone have the VIN for a Turbo? I think I could dig one up for a 1-Ton SRW. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bunneys Posted October 30, 2012 Share Posted October 30, 2012 The above is a SRW 1Ton, 14"rims different axle shafts if I remember right, 8" rear end as apposed to the standard 7.5" 2wd 3rd member. Not a standard rear axle used in the regular 2wd. It will not bolt in to the 4X4 trucks with out modification, I don't know about 2wd?? Maby... I believe the spline count is also different ( EDIT, 27 spline count for the 2WD and 30 for the 4wd, the DRW 3rd uses 30 too) so you cant use the 3rd member in the truck / 4Runner. This is all from my memory... Why would want to do this but not the 1 ton dully swap though? 2nd edit: Looking a bit further into it, this might be the same axle in the RV's to began with. So when you add the extra force of the dully it will fail... hence the recall. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Totem Posted October 30, 2012 Share Posted October 30, 2012 just going to add your excellent swap thread to this: http://toyotamotorho...?showtopic=4508 good lord the front hubs was a pain to get done.. re-reading this almost made me need excedrin. The rig tracks way better with the one tons though; totally glad I did it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek up North Posted October 30, 2012 Share Posted October 30, 2012 The above is a SRW 1Ton, 14"rims different axle shafts if I remember right, 8" rear end as apposed to the standard 7.5" 2wd 3rd member. The 'G' in the MH Axle Code indicates that it's an 8" diff. AFAIK, the same as in 2wd trucks & 4Runners. And, I think, 4wd too. http://www.brian894x...osanddiffs.html Typically found in our MHs is the G292 & G294, occasionally G284. Edit: The Axle Code only describes the diff and not whether it's a FF or not. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek up North Posted October 31, 2012 Share Posted October 31, 2012 I think I could dig one up for a 1-Ton SRW. Here's the VIN from a 1-Ton SRW pickup that was on EBay a while back, if anyone wants to see if there's a difference in axles, bearings, brakes, etc. from your 1/2 Ton based 'home. JT4RN55E5G0220223 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
linda s Posted October 31, 2012 Share Posted October 31, 2012 Spent a ton of time trying to compare the toyota 1 ton with a half ton and just deleted it so I didn't confuse anyone. On my search for 1 ton parts I discovered it was only giving me info for the dual wheel 1 ton, not the single. I give up Linda S Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Totem Posted October 31, 2012 Share Posted October 31, 2012 yeah I was skeptical when i saw where this was going.. when I learned I had death axle right after I bought my rig I went nuts trying to find a cheaper alternative to sourcing and shipping the full floater. All of you folks were singing the same tune back then; that it MUST be a full floater or nothing. Now all of a sudden everyone seems to think a single axle and one heavy duty tire/wheel may just possibly work but no one can show an example or for that matter come up with a reason why it would even be wise to do this with that much weight. No shame in changing opinions on safety... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
linda s Posted October 31, 2012 Share Posted October 31, 2012 Well I just went back and forth between my full floater and the 1 ton derek posted the vin for and something strange comes up. The 1 ton shows 2 sets of bearings the exact same part numbers as my full floater. Same differential and carrier. Different axle shafts and same brake shoe but different drums. Don't know what all this adds up to but definately sounds like a step up from the half ton. I already gave an example of a single wheel axle used succesfully on a toyhome. The Odyssey 4x4's had the regular v6 axle and single wheels. Timmy recenly drove his Odyssey from southern California to Alaska. He's having some problems with his rig but none related to the axle. He also pulled a dumb stunt recently and loaded his rig with 7 friends and kayaks on the roof for all. His wall caved in some but his axle was fine. As far as the weight Toyota sets the GVWR and it lists the 86 1 ton as the exact same weight rating as the full floater. Linda S See Derek we can agree on some things Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bajadulce Posted October 31, 2012 Share Posted October 31, 2012 I have a 16' (Not 18' and certainly not 21') Sunrader, modified with all the intentions to keep as light as possible. It has a Tundra axle (T100 same thing) and single 15" wheels. Even this setup I feel is somewhat pushing the envelope and am contemplating eventually putting 16" tires (my vehicle came stock with 16" next year/same body) on a full floating Landcruiser axle OR possibly just getting a beefier truck (Yes, that would be the 4th truck for this rig). Almost every motorhome is overloaded. It's in our nature to load up our rigs. And so a 21' motorhome is going to get overloaded. Putting something this big on a single 15" wheel w/ a non-floating axle doesn't seem like a prudent move. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Totem Posted October 31, 2012 Share Posted October 31, 2012 omg need to see picture of caved in wall...LOL that made me laugh Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
linda s Posted October 31, 2012 Share Posted October 31, 2012 omg need to see picture of caved in wall...LOL that made me laugh Not really funny but he caused some of the problems. he had water damage when he bought it but didn't know of course. Not caved in but bent out some. Not too visible Linda S Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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