Propane heater leak on Chinook

[george101]

Hi All,

I have been using my propane heater for awhile without any problems. However, the other day I had turned the heater on for 2 days to dry out a carpet after it had gotten wet. After the second day that the heater was on, I noticed that it smelled like propane inside the camper. I immediately shut off the propane from the tank and then shut off the thermostat.

It seems that the propane smell only occurs when both the propane tank is opened and the thermostat is on. Obviously, when when the thermostat is on, it releases propane to burn into the air for the pilot light, but I don't think I should be able to smell the propane because it should be getting burnt up by the pilot light.

So, it seems that there's a problem with the actual heater leaking and not the pipes running to the heater. Not entirely sure what to do on this one. Not sure if there's a place that would service this type of thing. Definitely not something I want to be playing around with due to safety issues.

Has anyone else had a similar problem?

-George

[acudoc]

Are you sure you have a pilot light?

Most have a electric starter. Only very old models had pilot lights.

Hi All,

I have been using my propane heater for awhile without any problems. However, the other day I had turned the heater on for 2 days to dry out a carpet after it had gotten wet. After the second day that the heater was on, I noticed that it smelled like propane inside the camper. I immediately shut off the propane from the tank and then shut off the thermostat.

It seems that the propane smell only occurs when both the propane tank is opened and the thermostat is on. Obviously, when when the thermostat is on, it releases propane to burn into the air for the pilot light, but I don't think I should be able to smell the propane because it should be getting burnt up by the pilot light.

So, it seems that there's a problem with the actual heater leaking and not the pipes running to the heater. Not entirely sure what to do on this one. Not sure if there's a place that would service this type of thing. Definitely not something I want to be playing around with due to safety issues.

Has anyone else had a similar problem?

-George

[Maineah]

Not a good thing to have a propane leak. Burnt propane does have a smell to it is there a good flow of air from the heater exhaust? Just wondering if you may have a restricted exhaust bee's nest maybe?

[george101]

Not a good thing to have a propane leak. Burnt propane does have a smell to it is there a good flow of air from the heater exhaust? Just wondering if you may have a restricted exhaust bee's nest maybe?

It does have a pilot light. It's a 78 camper, so it is pretty old. Although, on closer inspection today, it looked as though there were three prongs coming close together where you light the pilot light. One prong is the incoming propane pipe, but I got to wondering if perhaps at some point you could click a switch for the other two prongs to ignite a spark.

What does "burnt propane" smell like? Does it smell like propane? I did notice the propane smell after running the heater for two consecutive days. Perhaps I was just smelling burnt propane? I had used it about 3 weeks before this incident every day for a week, just to warm the camper up at night while I was sleeping in it. I never noticed the smell then. Of course, maybe the burnt propane smell didn't have enough time to collect because I only had it on from about 11PM until 7AM. (8 hours)

There is a good fan that sucks the exhaust of the heater out of the side of the camper. It works so well, I sometimes wonder if I'm heating the outdoors up more than the indoors. :-\

I'd like to bring it to a qualified professional to inspect it. I just don't know who would prepare such things. I contacted a couple RV stores, and they all seemed pretty uninterested in looking at it for me.

[twoblocked]

Do you know the make and model of the furnace? Sometimes you can find the original owner/installation manual online. They may have a troubleshooting section that could be helpful to us.

Usually there is a single flare nut connection on the incoming propane line to the furnace, you could check this for leaks with a solution of sudsy dishwater soap and a small brush. With a manual you would know where the propane goes next and test that fitting. And so on. If you smell raw propane (and it sounds like you do) there is a leak somewhere. Just need to track it down and tighten it.

If the thermocouple (a small prong device over the burner/pilot light) is working properly, propane will not flow to the burner/pilot light (even with the thermostat set high) and you should not be smelling propane.

It does have a pilot light. It's a 78 camper, so it is pretty old.

[5Toyota]

i have been gased before with carbon monoxide at work from rusted out and cracked heaters. are you smelling raw propane i have a 1978 standing pilot. the gas valve shuts off the gas with pilot off you should not smell any gas could be a bad gas valve . but sorry to say those furnece are way too old. gas heaters are aways prone too rust through or cracking open they can and will kill you we worked in a large factory and we were very sick get a monoxide alarm. I do not exp there are even any parts for one that old. i was going to put in a new one bought a newer moterhome instead.I I know of no reson too smell burned propane unless you have holes in the firebox if that is the case it could kill you.

[5Toyota]

too light the pilot you should have aSaft ey button y ou hold in while lighting the pilot until the pilot stays lit when not lit no gas should come out at all saftey design.

[george101]

Yes, it does have a saftey button. It's referred to as the "Reset Button" on my camper. You have to hold this in for a minute and then you can light the pilot light.

I would prefer to replace the whole unit, to tell the truth, if there was a heater that was the same size as mine and would go directly into the same spot. Just don't know where I'd find one, or where I could find someone to install it. I'd like to have a professional install it, of course. I don't like to mess around with these types of things.

[5Toyota]

they still make the Suburban and theHydro Flame Direct discharge no ducts several sizes Are there no rv shops in your area. you can Go look up these companys on the Internet they show diff models look on your old one make brand and shouldbe a plate shouwing BTU output. my 1978 is a direct discharge they are auto light now. myn is very small mounted in the bottom of the closet . but they are around 5 or 6 hundred but what is the price of being alive. had a frend years ago his brother had truck camper .They figer the oven leak gas got out of bed light the oven Blue Upthe camper all windowa out Burned so bad he Lived for Three weeks and died.

[george101]

5Toyota,

I am very sorry to hear about your friend. That is horrible. My condolences.

I know these types of things can happen when dealing with such dangerous substances. I am very leery of using propane, and propane links. You are absolutely right that it is worthwhile to get a new system put in. Do you know if a place like Suburban installs these systems?

It almost makes me not want to use propane at all, to be truthful.

-George

[5Toyota]

SOORY to scare you that wsa abou t 36 years ago. Suburban is a brand Are there any rv repair shops around your area they most often sell this stuff if you talked too them about the old one . talk too them about a estamet for a new one Propane is good if we take care you are smart enough too already realized there was somthing wrong. get a new furnace installed i never leave my oven lit when not in use or at night and the oven also is designed too not leak gas when not lit . never had any smell of gas in it. did you look up some of them on company websits THAT person was more than 70 and not as alert as mabe he should of been

[Derek up North]

Propane detectors are cheap enough. Add one to a Carbon Monoxide (CO) detector and you'll sleep better.

[5Toyota]

Derek Kudos for you Those modern saftey Must Haves are there for a reson. maybe you can help this person some more Bet you spell better LOL

[Maineah]

You bet ya Derek and put it close to the floor.

[90toydolphin]

needs to be said one more time, mount at floor level, no choices, propane is heavier than air and if it's mounted high you mh will fill with gas before it reaches the detector, mh full of propane very similar to a bomb.

[george101]

Yeah, I have a very good carbon monixide detector that is in the camper. It's very sensitive, and goes off all the time. But I'm not sure if it detects propane. A propane detector is an excellent idea. I'll pick one up. Thanks for the suggestion.

However, I have another quasi safety question for everyone. I've been plagued with an exhaust manifold leak since I bought the camper. I have replaced the gaskets probably around 7 times (actually, yes, literally 7 times!!). I had the exhaust manifold planed down. There's an intake pipe that comes into the exhaust manifold which had a slight hole in it, which I replaced with a new junkyard pipe. I payed my mechanic to fix it professionally 2 weeks ago. It stayed fixed for about 2 weeks and then blew again the other day.

So, my questions are:

1. Has anyone else had this problem with their chinook (I'm guessing they have, because I've never heard a "quiet chinook", and I am coming to the conclusion that the exhaust manifold was not designed to take the amount of pressure that comes out of the engine). And if you have had this problem, did you figure out a way to fix it?

2. Is it a health risk to have a hole in the manifold? Or is it ok, as long as you roll down the windows when you're driving.

Thanks,

George

[5Toyota]

Those old 20rs org did not have an ext manifold gasket set on the head between the manifold and the head the felpro after market ext gasket set will help org all they had was the carb heat box rear half between the head and manifold. if ypu mean the long pipe bolts on the manofold where i live i took that off made covers for the holes. a pluged catlitc convertor or evena bad muffler can back pressure the eng. the org manofold was also subject too horzontal cracking they m ade a re engered manifold bought one about 1985 back then 150 doolors. it look some different. i have had 3 20rs. even the22r or re are hard on the pipe doenuts put 2 sets on my 88 4wd. bit the last has been ok. a hole in the manofold can be dangerous carbon monoxide agin

[george101]

they m ade a re engered manifold bought one about 1985 back then 150 doolors. it look some different.

Thanks again man!

Can I still get one of these reenginered manifolds?? That would be awsome. I've come to the conclusion that the manifold I have is just not properly engineered for the amount of pressure coming out of the engine. It sounds like Toyota (or some after market company) came to the same conclusion, and decided that they needed to reengineer it.

Do you know of a place I could still get the reengineered manifold?

[george101]

Did it look something like this maybe?

http://www.jtoutfitters.com/exhaust-header-toyota-pickup-mini-truck-celica-p-746.html

[Maineah]

If It's a 20R they were also known to crack the manifolds the whole thing was wrapped in a metal shroud with a fire proof gasket and they got way hot and cracked. The shroud it's self was the gasket how old is this thing? There is supposed to be a bracket on the down pipe that is attached to the transmission if it's not there it's going to cause an exhaust leak eventually also the Toyota nuts on the manifold are shake resistant nuts as are the ones on the down pipe so if you are having consistent problems it's best to replace all of the nuts and bracket with Toyota parts. Pressure is not your enemy it's either working loose and burning the gasket up or some thing is not sealing right.

[5Toyota]

not at all that is a nice header Toyota offered a redesined all cast iron manifold that did not crack . but if a header will work why not. for the new to the discution we are talking 1978 20r.Maneah You are corr ect the rear half of carb heat box was all they had for a exst gasket. i once had a mufler come a part inside ALL THE BAFFLES blew back aginst the outlet closing it of and back pressuring the eng. that was on my 884wd xtra cab. Ihad too replace the Ma nifold on my 1977 20 R powered CORONA STATION WAGEN . Because it was cracked. IALSO installed the after market felpro brand ext Gasket set it helps a lot CHECK with Toyota i do not know if they if they still havethem IF YOU FIND AN UN CRACKED MANIFOLD IN A JUNK YARD CHANCES ARE IT IS THE REDSINED ONE AS VIRTULY ALL OF THE ORGANAL ONES CRACKED> long cracks right on the out side in the middle. THE 20R was used in the CELICA ,CORONA, AND the TRUCKS> ALL SAME

[george101]

I ordered it up. Will install and let you know how it goes.

My current ex mani doesn't have a crack in it. Although the camper only has 50k on it. I just think it was designed poorly, and can't take the pressure.

[waiter]

Did you resolve the Propane leak???

John Mc

88 Dolphin 4 Auto

[george101]

Nope.

Haven't got to that one yet.

[Derek up North]

Did you resolve the Propane leak???

You didn't hear the 'BANG'?

[5Toyota]

at 62000 the one on my wagen was cracked. would not mind seeing a picture of the one you remove. maybe it is the replacement one.toyota sold back in the day. all of the first ones cracked.

[Derek up North]

Did you resolve the Propane leak???

You didn't hear the 'BANG'?

[george101]

Ya, I'll snap a picture of it. It may take a couple days.

[george101]

Hi All,

Sorry about being late to get the pics. I've included a bunch in this post.

So, I got the new header. This is displayed in 85.jpg. You'll see how it has seperate/distinct pipes, which is different from the original cast iron manifold displayed in 90.jpg and 95.jpg and 93.jpg. In 95/90/93.jpg you'll see how the exhaust feeds into one pipe, instead of having separate pipes, like in the header.

Pics 98 and 97 display the attachement from the exhaust mani to the rest of the exhaust system which leads down the muffler eventually. My mechanic cut off the mouth to this pipe and welded in a new one.

96.jpg displays the heat sheild. There's another piece to the heat shield, but I just didn't provide a pic of it. This is a necessary component for the original exhaust mani because it drastically reduces the heat and prevents everything around the mani from melting.

99.jpg is this Dow Corning gunck in a tube. It's used on jet airplanes. Someone in another forum said you can use this instead of the exhaust mani gasket, because it can go to extreme hot and cold temps without cracking. I didn't use it, but I might be using soon because..........

I got the new header put on, as you can see in the 85.jpg pic. It was originally covered with black paint, but the paint burnt off after my mechanic installed it and ran the motor for awhile. It is much quiter with the new header on. It sounds like a normal vehicle. With the new header, my mechanic said that I don't need the heat sheild, so that's why you can clearly see the header in that pic, because it doesn't have the sheild covering it.

So, as far as sound goes, it works. awesome. Sounds like a normal car now. HOWEVER, I am STILL getting carbon menoxide into the cab!!! This is the 8th time trying to fix this problem. I have sunk far more money into this then I even like to think about, and I still have this problem. I can't drive it more than 10 miles without getting a woozy feeling. It sucks. I really don't know what to do in order to permanetly fix this problem. I think I've done every logical thing that I can possibly think of to get this problem fixed, and I am still getting exhaust fumes in the cab. The only thing I can possibly think to do at this point, is to tear all the work apart that my mechanic previously did, take off the gasket for the header, and use that Dow Corning goop instead of a gasket, and maybe this will seal it properly. But I have serious doubts, given this track record.

[Maineah]

The heat shield was part of the carb preheat system and it was the cause of all most every exhaust manifold cracking it completely incased the manifold and they got some hot with no air to cool them! It was not one of Toyota's better ideals. Over the years I bet I welded or replaced 5 dozen of them and ddn't bother to put the cover back on. Good luck with the headers.

[WME]

What gasket is blowing? The one between the head and manifold or the one between the manifold and down tube??

[5Toyota]

THAT DOES LOOK LIKE THE REPLACMENT CAST IRON ONE THAT DID NOT CRACK.. they are shaped diff then the org design. i don rember if ther is anyway gases can come out of that smog pipe i pinched myn shut and welded it shut cut off first of course.

[george101]

THAT DOES LOOK LIKE THE REPLACMENT CAST IRON ONE THAT DID NOT CRACK.. they are shaped diff then the org design. i don rember if ther is anyway gases can come out of that smog pipe i pinched myn shut and welded it shut cut off first of course.

Oh, it does? Hmm. Yeah, I don't know. I guess I'll keep the header on there, because I bought it now. Seems to keep the camper a bit more quiet. I'm assuming that it was planed flat from the factory, but maybe that's too great of an assumption. It's made from steel, so I think that it's less likely to warp than the cast iron mani.

Not sure where to go from here. I can't drive it cause of all carbon monixide coming in. I guess I could rip the whole thing apart, try to get the header planed at a machine shop and try putting it back together with just the goop and without the gasket. Dunno. Or, I guess I could also bring it to a muffler place, and see if they could do a better job than my current mechanic. Although, he's pretty good. But there's another 200-300 down the drain. I'm already into this thing like 700-800 bucks. Maybe I should make it an even grand. ha! Although, I probably still won't have fixed the problem, the way this has been going.

But, ya, If I bring it to the shop, I might have them weld that pipe directly so it will eliminate that as a source of a leak. The less places it could be leaking, the better, I think.

[waiter]

George - Hows the rest of the exhaust system look. Does the tail pipe go all the way to the back? Could the fumes be coming in from the back?

John Mc

88 Dolphin 4 Auto

[WME]

If you have a composite gasket try soaking it in water for a couple of hr, it its steel never mind.

EDIT. To check you system for leaks just take a rag and wad it up and hold it over the tailpipe. Any leak will show up as a really loud angry hisssss.

If you can't find a leak this way, then you may be sucking fumes back into the RV from the tail pipe. Make sure that your tail pipe exits past the outside of the unit. Also a if there is a leak or crack in the MH house part, opening a vent window or window will cause a low pressure inside the house and suck the exhaust fumes inside through the crack.