Yokahama 195/75/14 on a 87 Itasca?

[Back East Don]

I am looking to get a Self Contained Vehicle permit to be able to camp on the beach on the National Seashore on Cape Cod. I've got the vehicle set up and all the required safety gear and the last detail is tires. The minimum specification for 14 inch tire width is 195 in order to pass their inspection. Before I go out and spend a grand on 7 tires (Even the spare has to meet spec) figured I find out what the issues are.

The Yokahama is listed as one of the few options available in a load range D that has a street tread which is important for riding on sand. (Tire Rack)

I used to have a dune permit years ago with my Landcruiser but feel it would be totally worth spending a grand on tires to be able to camp right on the beach. Even if they wear somewhat prematurely.

So what are the issues? Are the 195's that tight?

Appreciate your input on this,

Don

[Derek up North]

I'm not sure I understand what you mean by 'tight'?

I've looked at the Yokohama specs on TireRack often. I've always been baffled by the 195/75R24.(Remember that the 185 & 195 numbers are NOMINAL.) The specs show that the 185R14 & 195/75R14 are both the same width* and diameter. (I'm not sure why they offer both!). The 195 offers less Load capacity and I think are more expensive. But if you absolutely need tires marked 195, go for it. The only other 195s that I know of are from Continental (195R14).

* Once you factor in the different 'measured rim width'.

[linda s]

Nexen also makes a 195r14 tire. Might save a little money on them and they are good tires.

http://www.discounte...10558N&pID=7639

Linda S

[tumolt]

I have been looking at Continental Vanco 8 and Hankook RA08 tires. Went with standard 215 70 14 Firestone tires 4 years ago since the load range was 980 lbs. per tire and with 6 was well within tolerance since the MH weighs less than 4800 lbs. Vanco's are not good on snow and ice, otherwise they seem suitable. Hankook were good on both and offered great tracking. I have not been able to differentiate between R.V. tires and Motor home tires. Is there a difference and what is best for my use. I know with my dually rear wheels I have good off road traction. I want something good for wet weather slick roads and low noise.

[linda s]

Your tires are not the right ones. The thinner side walls will flex excessivly when on the road causing heat build up and with that size the rear tires might rub between the duallies causing a blowout. Wondering what model motorhome you have that weighs only 4800 lbs. My 18ft Sunrader weighs in at 5000lbs. Also if you have a blowout in the rear you then only have one tire holding up at least twice the weight it should. With the correct tires you would still be able to limp in to a service station. I have done it. But in your case your stuck.

LS

I have been looking at Continental Vanco 8 and Hankook RA08 tires. Went with standard 215 70 14 Firestone tires 4 years ago since the load range was 980 lbs. per tire and with 6 was well within tolerance since the MH weighs less than 4800 lbs. Vanco's are not good on snow and ice, otherwise they seem suitable. Hankook were good on both and offered great tracking. I have not been able to differentiate between R.V. tires and Motor home tires. Is there a difference and what is best for my use. I know with my dually rear wheels I have good off road traction. I want something good for wet weather slick roads and low noise.

[Back East Don]

Derek

I started reading some of the tire posts this morning and there was some discussion as to the 195 rubbing up against each other. Hence the question.

This morning I went out to pick up fan belts (had one squeeling on this trip) and while out I stopped by to get an estimate on the tires. $102 each is not bad but that is before tax and mounting. I took a look at the spacing of the rear tires and there seems to be plenty of space between the two. Keep in mind that in order to go out on the sand, tire pressure is reduced to 7 psi. This was also a question I posed to my tire guy. I used to do this with my landcruiser with no problem but those tires didn't go from 60 psi to 7.

The load range diference is a factor but what is on there now is rated at 1710 same as these.

So far very useful info. Waiting to find out how long it will take them to get them and then will have to make a decision.

Don

[linda s]

Derek

I started reading some of the tire posts this morning and there was some discussion as to the 195 rubbing up against each other. Hence the question.

This morning I went out to pick up fan belts (had one squeeling on this trip) and while out I stopped by to get an estimate on the tires. $102 each is not bad but that is before tax and mounting. I took a look at the spacing of the rear tires and there seems to be plenty of space between the two. Keep in mind that in order to go out on the sand, tire pressure is reduced to 7 psi. This was also a question I posed to my tire guy. I used to do this with my landcruiser with no problem but those tires didn't go from 60 psi to 7.

The load range diference is a factor but what is on there now is rated at 1710 same as these.

So far very useful info. Waiting to find out how long it will take them to get them and then will have to make a decision.

Don

195's will not rub. I was refering to the 215's Tumolt said he was using. That said I would never reduce the pressure on the duallies to 7. That is lower than even the 4x4 sites recommend for sand driving. Looks like 1/3 of the regular pressure but not enough to let the duallies rub. Means no lower than 20lbs pressure on the front but about 30 in the back.

LS

[Derek up North]

I've not heard of anyone having rubbing problems with 195 tires. In fact some late Toyota MHs were supplied OEM with 195R14 tires. A 'passenger' tire (P195/70R14) might be a different thing since 'P' tires have softer sidewalls and will bulge out more at ground level.

7psig sounds pretty extreme to me. But I'm not an offroader. I guess if you're stuck in the mud (or sand) somewhere, you do what you've got to do to get unstuck! Not something I'd want to try for anything but the slowest speed and the shortest distance possible.

Load/Inflation tables will give you the Minimum pressure for a given load. I recently managed to get my hands on the table for 185R14 Load Range C & D.

http://toyotamotorho...?showtopic=4680

I'd suggest you contact Hankook (as I did) because they were very helpful and ask about 195R14 tires. Though they don't offer 195R14, they might go the distance and help. All the different tire manufacturers work with the same numbers. The tables are developed by the ETRTO and/or TRA, not the tire makers.

Note that a Load Range C tire at it's max. pressure of 50psi has exactly the same load carrying capacity as a Load Range D also inflated to 50psi.

[waiter]

The Hankook tires a a light truck tire, not a passanger car tire. They do not have an aggressive tread pattern and I don't believe should they be considered an "all weather" tire. They are a highway tire.

I'm curious as to how your state can override a manufactures recommendation for tires.. i.e. If Toyota says to use a 185r14, then how can the state say you must have a 195??

John Mc

88 Dolphin 4 Auto

[linda s]

The Hankook tires a a light truck tire, not a passanger car tire. They do not have an aggressive tread pattern and I don't believe should they be considered an "all weather" tire. They are a highway tire.

I'm curious as to how your state can override a manufactures recommendation for tires.. i.e. If Toyota says to use a 185r14, then how can th estate say you must have a 195??

John Mc

88 Dolphin 4 Auto

It's about preservation of the beach John and they are trying to keep out very narrow tires that would leave excessive rutting in the sand. He's just lucky the allowed width starts at 195. States can control what tires you use on their highways too. Lots of states don't allow studded tires no matter what the season. Some of those states get a good amount of snow too

Linda

[Derek up North]

I have been looking at Continental Vanco 8 and Hankook RA08 tires. Vanco's are not good on snow and ice, otherwise they seem suitable. Hankook were good on both and offered great tracking.

I think you mean Vanco2. I don't think Vanco8 are available in 14" (but I'm often wrong!) For Ice and snow you need VancoWinter tires. Conti lists the Vanco2 as a 'Summer' tire. Hankook lists the RA08 as an 'All Season'.

Went with standard 215 70 14 Firestone tires 4 years ago since the load range was 980 lbs. per tire and with 6 was well within tolerance since the MH weighs less than 4800 lbs.

Ignoring the possible rubbing problem, there's a recommendation (can't recall where I read it) that passenger tires fitted to a van or SUV have the load capacity reduced by 10%, so your 980lb becomes 882lb. Also tires fitted to a dually axle have a 'discount', usually around 5%. So your 882lb is now 838lb. (882 x 2) + (838 x 4) = 5116lb. You're getting awfully close to 4800lb. You've weighed yours, or is 4800lb the GVWR marked on a label somewhere?

I have not been able to differentiate between R.V. tires and Motor home tires. Is there a difference and what is best for my use. I know with my dually rear wheels I have good off road traction. I want something good for wet weather slick roads and low noise.

I don't know if there's such a thing as an 'RV' or 'Motorhome' tire. I think we're all driving on 'Van' tires

[waiter]

No way that Itasca weighs 4800 lbs, I bet its 6000 to 6500.

ALSO - Whats the difference between the 195 and the 185 r14's Is it diameter???

JOhn Mc

88 Dolphin 4 Auto

[Back East Don]

And here I was wondering if I would get any response. I figured well, the subject was tires.

This has turned into a lively discussion.

Linda was exactly correct. The issue has always been about balancing preservation and still letting people use the coastline. They will very quickly tell you that you don't have to drive your vehicle on the beach. It used to be a lot stricter as they also had a list of acceptable tires. If you want to play, you have to play by their rules. I very much want to play. I'm just happy as it seems I'll be able to.

As to the pressure being that low, it has always been so. You lower the pressure when you arrive, drive really slow (no more than 5mph) for a limited distance and park. When you are ready to leave there is a air station to refil. I never had any trouble with the landcruiser. They issue 2000 permits a year to vehicles and everyone has the same issue. There used to be large 4x4 conversion RV on the sand. They limit the number of RV's to 200 a night and it is sometime difficult to get on because it is full.

I've basically decided to just pull the trigger and go for it. Last weekend was our first outing with the RV. Sort of a dry run up to Maine to make sure all systems were working. Still have many small finish details left like hooking up the TV and inverter and some misc trim stuff.

Thank you all for the help. At least I know the size won't be a hazard issue.

[Derek up North]

And here I was wondering if I would get any response. I figured well, the subject was tires.

This has turned into a lively discussion.

Are you kidding? Tires is about the most common topic! Makes a nice change to have to consider your particular 'twist'. Can't say it's come up before.

[Davidadro]

I have been running the same SIGNET EXPRESS ST tires on my Dolphin since it was purchased in 2007, and they are C rated in load, and have a 6 ply All Season design. The size all around on my Dolphin is 205/75R 14. These are actually wider than the 195 mentioned in your post, and I never have had any rubbing or found the duals touching together under any load I have had on them. They have served me well, and think if you need to put the narrower 195's on to comply with the park, it should be just fine to do so without issue Back East Don. I dont know if this will be of help, but the link below is a tire size and width calculator from Discount Tire that will give you all the differences between the confusing numbers, to actual height and width measurements in inches. http://www.discountt...nfoTireMath.dos

Here's a place one can get a set of 4 of the tires I mentioned and have used for less than $350.00

http://www.traileran...f-4_p_1447.html

They are listed as Trailer Tires on this particular site, but they are listed as good rated all season highway tires at other places like Sears.

I know there are mixed reviews about mixing tires, as some say never use different tires front and back, and others say its fine as long as the size and alike tire is on the oppisite side as well. With that said, my Dolphin was bought with the 4 Signets on the duals in back, and Firestone Supreme radials on the front. They have a better tread design for better handling, grip and water channeling I'm thinking why they made that choice. The Supreme is not available anymore aparantly, so no info about them.

Good Luck, and PEACE!

Edited May 30, 2012 by Davidadro

[Derek up North]

I just did a quick search and everything that pops up calls them a 6-ply trailer tire. The 'ST' in the name is usually a dead giveaway that they are a trailer tire. Are the actually marked ST205/75R14? Often (always) trailer tires are marked 'Trailer Use Only' on the sidewall.

$350 for 4? I think I'd rather pay $400 for 4 (out the door) Hankooks or Yokohamas than drive on a trailer tire.

Trailer tires are a different design to tires designed for either driven or steered wheels.

'Firestone Supreme' sounds suspiciously like a passenger car tire. What Load Range are they and what's the maximum inflation pressure?

[Davidadro]

I'm not sure about the Firestone's, but if my Signet tires are not proper road tires, then I should look into getting them replaced, and sorry for the advice I gave as I would never want to cause anyone harm, or possible injury, especially with tires.

This site lists them as all season tires

http://ssl.delti.com...4&nichtweiter=1

I also saw them at Sears.com as all season tires. But as you stated Derek, I do see most of the offerings as trailer tires. I've put thousands of miles on these since I bought the Dolphin 5 years ago........Wow....

Thanks for the info, and I guess if I wasnt bragging about the good luck with my rubber, I would have never had the important info from you, until maybe too late that is. I do thank you for your help. I guess the size matter was at least some help for Don, as I have never had a concern with the 205/75R 14 I mentioned by rubbing nor touching each other. I will investigate the brands you have mentioned and get my rubber changed. A shame too as the tread on them all are hardly worn away. Be well all, and peace!

Edited May 30, 2012 by Davidadro