CountryRoads Posted November 6, 2012 Share Posted November 6, 2012 I'm not sure if I have this question in the right forum, but I want to add an Olympian Wave catalytic heater to my 1990 Winnie Warrior. For those who already have them is a 3 large enough or do I need a 6? We live in Colorado so I'm looking for something that will handle more than a dip into the 50s at night. I'm also wondering if anyone knows where I can buy an installation kit for it. I've seen others recommend purchasing such a kit but haven't been able to find one online. One more question: has anyone done away with their factory installed propane furnace in favor of using just one or two of these catalytic heaters? CR Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maineah Posted November 7, 2012 Share Posted November 7, 2012 They do make vented catalytic heaters that would be the hot lick but I have heated mine in the winter with a MR Buddy and an external tank. They do have low O2 sensors but they do need make up air so a window opened a crack is important. I can't sleep through the RV heater it just makes too much noise. My dream MH would have radiant floors using a standard propane water heater and a small pump. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
waiter Posted November 7, 2012 Share Posted November 7, 2012 I've done research and testing on both the WAVE 3 (Catylist) and the Mr Buddy (Ceramic) Don't get confused by the words "Catylic" and "Ceramic". They are completely different methods for producing/radiating the heat. Catylic process doesn't "burn" in the normal sense, there is no flame, When the propane hits the pad that is saturated with a special chemical, it heats up to about 700 deg (The Cat converter on your car does exactly the same thing) The "Ceramic" heater has a flame that is used to heat a small ceramic plate, the plate helps radiate the heat more evenly. The WAVE 3 I have is good for 3000 btu, the Mr Buddy is good for 9000 btu Both units "radiate" their heat out the front, The Mr Buddy also dumps a lot of heat out the top, . be careful about whats above the heater, or if something can fall on top of the heater. Both units will dump a lot of moisture in the air, so plan on condensation. Both units consume Oxygen, need fresh air source, maybe crack a wing window a little) (I do not open a window, there are enough air leaks in the Toyhouse to provide fresh air.) Both units need to be vented, I open a roof vent about 1/2 inch, make sure the winds don't blow air in the roof vent. Both Units can produce Carbon Monoxide, install a CO detector/alarm (get the kind with digital readout, They are about $25 at big box hardware stores) The WAVE 3 produces significantly less CO because it doesn't "burn", The Mr Buddy will produce CO. Catylic process does not use a flame, Take note that the lighting process is different ) you will not see a flame. The WAVE 3 uses low pressure. I added a hose, valve, and quick disconnect to my existing LP system. The Mr Buddy uses high pressure LP. I modified it to use low pressure so I can use the same hose as the WAVE 3. WARNING, If your not comfortable modifying potential bombs, then don't do the Mr Buddy modification.) OPERATION we start the heater and set it in the floor in the doorway to the bath, making sure the area is clear, no towels or stuff can fall on the heater. Also can set the heaters on top of the stove cover. we run the heater all night, generally setting the furnace to 55 as an alternate heat source To shut the heater off, I turn the supply valve OFF and let the flame go out. Here's a link to show how I added a low pressure supply hose, and also modified the Mr Buddy to use low pressure. http://toyotamotorho...?showtopic=4328 John Mc 88 Dolphin 4 Auto Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CountryRoads Posted November 7, 2012 Author Share Posted November 7, 2012 Wow, thanks for all the info, John. Since you have the Wave 3 do you find that it provides enough heat? I guess I was reading reviews on amazon and many of the people with smallish MHs (under 23 feet) thought the 3 didn't provide enough warmth and moved up to the 6. I have the Winnie Warrior which has a relatively open floor plan. Rear bath, stove, sink and jack knife sofa/bed on one side and an L-shaped seating area and refrig on the other side. I'm also seriously thinking about pulling up the old carpeting and laying down lino because we have a dog and that would make it easier to clean. It might also not hold the heat the way carpet does. I was looking at the propane lines today and didn't see an easy access for adding a quick disconnect. I'll check your link and see where you added yours. CR Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek up North Posted November 7, 2012 Share Posted November 7, 2012 For those cold nights where a Wave 3 isn't enough, the solution is simple. Get 2 more dogs! I did. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
90toydolphin Posted November 8, 2012 Share Posted November 8, 2012 heat rises, not sure the flooring would make a big diff, but closing off the cab from the coach as well as insulating the vents on the roof and windows. some on here has done some things that are cheap and effective. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CountryRoads Posted November 8, 2012 Author Share Posted November 8, 2012 If I understand right, the catalytic heaters are radiant so they don't "blow" out hot air but instead heat up everything around it. So the more "soft" surfaces you have to radiate back the heat, the better. I was thinking carpeting would probably hold and radiate that heat better than vinyl. But I don't know for sure. I think 2 dogs is probably 1 too many for me, but they do make good little furnaces! CR Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeffrey Posted November 8, 2012 Share Posted November 8, 2012 When I lived in Crestone Colorado (elevation 8'000') a few years ago, I spent some winters there in an older '63 Airstream. Insulation in that seemed non-existent. I used two Wave 6's in it. It got to minus 20 and ice would form on this inside walls from the condensation, as John so eloquently described, from these heaters and me and my pets. Personally, I think these are great heaters. I've been thinking about installing one of my two in my '91 Winne Warrior but I'm not sure where. It has the legs but also can be mounted on the wall. Either way, might be a tight fit. Might have to sit on the floor, just inside the door, facing inward. Or, where the bathroom door is when pulled out. I guess I could hang it, although that might be a hassle. Then, there's the propane hose. I could bring that up through the floor somewhere since I have a "Y" off a propane line underneath the tank compartment with a quick release fitting attached (for an external tank). "So the more "soft" surfaces you have to radiate back the heat, the better. I was thinking carpeting would probably hold and radiate that heat better than vinyl." Actually, radiant heat does better in heating an area when the mass around it is denser, like a brick. The brick "holds" the heat, once it gets heated, much longer than your carpet or "soft", as you put it, surface. It just takes longer to warm the mass. 3 ways to heat something. Radiation, Convection and Conduction. Radiation: Energy is transfered by electromagnetic radiation, e.g. sun radiates heat (like wave 3/6 heater) to the earth. Ceramic heater uses Convection (energy is transfered by the mass motion of molecules) e.g. when there is a "fan" connected to a heater, although the ceramic material also radiates heat. A radiant floor utilizes Conduction (energy is transferred by direct contact) (floor heats from hot pipes) and when the floor gets hot it radiates to other forms of mass, but not the air. That's why with "radiation" objects are warm but air is cool, somewhat. Whereas, heat from convection warms the air, but objects generally aren't warm except closer to the heat source. Now if you could just build a small kachelofen... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maineah Posted November 8, 2012 Share Posted November 8, 2012 For those cold nights where a Wave 3 isn't enough, the solution is simple. Get 2 more dogs! I did. Two Great Danes seem to be enough so far so good. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
waiter Posted November 8, 2012 Share Posted November 8, 2012 Look around the internet, I seen were someone installed a WAVE 3 on a cabinet door. very clever, just make sure that door doesn't get closed with the heater running. My Dolphine doesn't have doors large enough to do this. :-( The WAVE 6 would probably be a better choice (6,000 btu). WAVE and Mr Buddy are "radiant" heaters, They radiate the heat like a campfire, so they will heat stuff around them. The Mr Buddy also does "Convective" heat, a lot of heat comes out the top. The closer to the floor, the more even the heat. Anything you can do to add insulation, the better, I have bubble wrap panels I made that I install on windows and roof vents. (not the roof vent that I leave open 1/2 inch for ventilation) John Mc 88 Dolphin 4 Auto Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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