[Generator won't run AC]

3 minutes ago, Totem said:

Yep that be the one.. the same one JJRBUS says is junk, but apparently 161 amazonians, and WME disagree with him also.

At this point it's a crap shoot anyways, I'm willing to spend the 12$ to see what happens.

On another note, how hard is it to install a new ac unit anyways? If we end up having to go that route at some point.

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https://smile.amazon.com/SPP6-Capacitor-Increase-Starting-Torque/dp/B0002YTLFE/ref=smi_se_mit_rcol_smi_2537928482?_encoding=UTF8&*Version*=1&*entries*=0&pldnCmp=rcol&pldnCrt=my-impact

 

Is this the correct one? Just want to make sure...

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1 minute ago, Totem said:

That would be what I refer to as the crap cap. That cap is so puny its only purpose is to keep the camp grounds breaker from tripping. Put a supco SPP6 in and you just might get it to run with that predator.

Worth a shot, got one in my cart on amazon and should be here tomorrow. Wish us luck.

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1 minute ago, jdemaris said:

I must admit I added the annotations on the photos pointed towards Totem.  The rest is all done by the guy formerly known as "Stamar" and now "Joelu."

It's the most amazing thing I've seen today. And I thank you for that.

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15 minutes ago, jdemaris said:

His name is "JoeLu" now and I'm sure he'd love to hear from you, Totem.

This is amazing. Who did this?!

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Also, what is this site you speak of totem? I would like to check it out. I suppose another 600 in isn't THAT bad

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Just checked out the capacitor, here's a picture. Looks pretty small to me.

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3 hours ago, Totem said:

ok ok, I believe you that you are real thanks to Derek.

That being said, I DID advise you on a 13500 rooftop AC not being what you would want if running on generator BEFORE you went and bought one.

I advised that you get a new AC in that case or a 3000 watt + genny.

Now that being said , I gave you the how to if you want to hack the 13500 in the 5 steps earlier.

Also, JJRBUS is totally wrong on the SPP6, dont listen to him until you CHECK your capacitor in your AC. If your cap is smaller and lower rated than the SPP6 I guarantee it will help to start it.

I know this because my stock 13500 coleman Mach 3 absolutely would NOT start with the stock factory starting capacitor that was the size of a film can. the Supco was much larger and higher rated. Once in It WOULD start easily in lower temps... and in higher temps and altitudes I would have to run the fan first for a bit and try it and back off try it and back off till it would catch. Trying it too long would trip the predator overload.

 

So let me apologize for jumping the gun and calling troll so fast but like I said, not following break in on the generator and trying to start that AC will ruin the generator unless you follow break in procedure...which takes hours of running with small or no load.

Its in the instruction manual. Also you need to add oil to it...

Hope this helps.

I would advise getting a coleman Mach 1 power saver edition 11,000 BTU and that predator as a good combo. If you want to use the AC you have , Again the Honda 3000 or the Yamaha 2800 are your better bets, Though I would STILL advise the supco no matter what.

It's okay, I wanted a quieter generator anyways. And besides, I can return it if I change my mind. And like I said previously, unless if I come into a bunch of money in the next few days I'm going to have to wait on the new airconditioner. Also, there's no way that a 3000 watt generator would fit in my tiny compartment sadly because at HF they had a bunch on sale that would have cost me less then the one I have now.

 

You have been very helpful, thanks for that. It didn't say much in the instruction manual about breaking it in, unless if I overlooked it which is possible. All I read was that it was not recommended that you run it over 70% capacitor for the first 25 hours or something, which I suppose could translate to break it in before trying to run your ac unit if I was more savvy on this subject. DOn't worry, oil was added, I'm not THAT stupid surprisingly.

 

Thanks again for your help. It's much appreciated.

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16 hours ago, WME said:

Its a bit late, but would the Predator run the fan only in the AC? The Briskair site says the minimum generator is 2500w for the 11,000btu AC and 3500w for the 13,500. 

Well there a bunch of experts on the net who know more than the AC MFG.

Unfortunately Y'all is bring a knife to a gun fight. As JDE has pointed some watts is more equal than other watts. You just need more watts some how.

My Onan 2800 would NOT start a 13500btu AC, with a booster cap it would. Most of the Onan surge rating comes from a huge flywheel.  

YES, just now checked that (since it was overlooked as my main concern has been the air conditioning) it does indeed run the fan on the ac. Good to know what briskair has to say about that. I was scouring my 20 year old air conditioning pamphlet and couldn't find that information anywhere. Sigh. Thanks for checking that out for me!

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18 hours ago, Back East Don said:

See, didn't I tell you Totem would be right along to help?

Don't take it the wrong way.  There is a lot going on with this and for the un-initiated, it can seem daunting.  There is a wealth of information to glean in the numerous threads with regard to both AC units and subsequently generators.

I'm not an expert but I'll give you my assessment of what you will likely need to do as at least a starting point.  This is an old RV with likely an old well worn AC unit.  You wouldn't be the first with problems.  First gain a bit of knowledge.  If we can all stop playing around here, perhaps we can actually assist you.  I'm not kidding, some of these people are as smart as they come. 

So those with some ideas, it is troubleshooting 101.  Lets see if we can figure out if this is a load issue.  jdemaris speaks a lot about the compressor loads and the math.  Me, I'm wondering if your starter cap might not have an issue.  Some have had problems and found the wiring to the cap loose.  I've some recollection of it.  You read a lot of posts over 6 years. 

So if we can get some brain power a little better than mine and come up with a plan, you on board?  Sorry I poked a bit of fun. It was never intended to be at your expense. 

Oh, I don't mind the joking around. I will do some poking around the internet and the ac unit and see if I can't figure it out. Yes, I do welcome all information, I can tell that you guys really do know what you're talking about! I do greatly appreciate everybodys input. I'll let you know what I figure out (if anything) about our start capacitor.

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18 hours ago, jjrbus said:

  Don't bet the farm on the Supco being a magical cure all! It may or may not work.  Something else to think about is the 13.5 might be too large for your RV.  When I looked at the AC I thought that 9K BTU would be just about right. The available Coleman Polar cub is 9200 BTU but has too much negative feedback. And is not the most energy efficient unit.

not to get some attitude from some guy on the internet   Don't judge the whole forum by one person, most here are pretty decent.    Jim

 

 

Oh, don't worry, I'm not judging the whole forum! I actually think this place is pretty great. And I totally agree, the 13.5 seems much to large and I have no idea why anyone would put that monster in a 21 foot motorhome. However, I don't exactly have the pockets to be dishing out money on whatever I want whenever I want. But at this point with everyones input I am highly considering saving up to buy a new a.c. unit.

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Just for you totem

 

 

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7 hours ago, Totem said:

I think the OP of this thread is JJRBUS. after re-reading it.. its just darned too convenient.

they come in here and Join on Sunday, they compliment his hard work and all..

Come on JJ.. fess up.

if I am wrong I want pics of the RV at least from the OP. come on. you guys are messing with me right?

 

Okay, I'll give you a picture, I have nothing to hide. Why wouldn't I compliment JJrbus,, at least he's being nice and helpful.

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9 hours ago, Totem said:

i call troll...

read my advice and by the way you didnt break in the generator. not enough time passed. at least if you are going to come in here and mess with me be believable.

NEXT!

Like I said before, unless if you need me to quote myself on this, this is the  FIRST generator I have ever owned so, like I said before I have no idea what I'm doing. I'm on this site to maybe get some help, not to get some attitude from some guy on the internet . You could have mentioned all these other steps I had to go through to make it work in the beginning. I even asked about a hard start capacitorr in my very first post but  from what I recall you never mentioned it until now. So, back to the real problem at hand if you're done deciding I'm a troll. I was unaware that you have to break in a generator (remember, its my FIRST generator). Do you break it in by just running it, with a load, without a load? How will that help?

My airconditioner is a Duo-Therm by Dometic, it also says it's a Briskair. If my math is correct the watts it takes to start the ac unit is 7,620. To keep the unit running it takes 1,776 watts. In no way am I saying I did that correctly. So, if I install the hard start capacitor, you're saying it will take over 5,000 less to start the ac?

 

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20 minutes ago, Back East Don said:

Totem will be right over to help you out.

This is a very intelligent bunch though it is hard to tell some days.

I literally laughed out loud!

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30 minutes ago, jjrbus said:

Very sorry to hear, that is why I am cautious about encouraging people to do something that may not work!  Without some proper test equipment it is hard to pin down the actual cause.  At this point we do not know how much the AC is drawing or how much the HF genset is putting out, it could be defective. Some options are try the genset on a large current draw item, an electric compressor, space heater, to see if it works.

If you know an electrician who could check the output of the genset and draw of the AC would be ideal or if you are up to the task learn to test it yourself. Time consuming but it is not rocket science. A test light to say it is producing electric is not enough, but a good start. You need to know it is putting out what it is rated at.   Another  option is to check with HF and tell them you believe you have a faulty genset and see if they will test it for you.

If it was me I would start with finding out if the genset is doing what it is suppose to do.   With a little disclaimer I am not an electrician or much of an expert at anything, just telling you what I would do.

                         Jim SW FL

Luckily I made sure I could return it even after using it, or else I would have been more cautious haha. We have some other ideas such as possibly wiring a swich so we can either JUST run the a.c. or everything else. If that makes any sense. My father is pretty RV savvy so he has some idea of what he's doing, unlike me. Though I would be curious to see if it is really putting out the watts it says it is. We're going to try testing it on a few other things and see what happens. I'm honestly hoping it's defective but we'll see!

Thanks for your input!

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7 hours ago, Totem said:

and yet no one is left claiming the eu2000i is well suited to run rooftop AC (11,000 - 13500) and whole house RV  in high heat, elevation, for up to 8 hours a session anymore... agreed?

jjrbus agree?

maineah agree?

jde agree?

because guess what... the HF will.. and has... just my personal experience but then again its designed for the proper wattage needed as Maineah pointed out.

So to come full circle in my journey; they just dont offer a product in that 2500-2800 power range (Honda), that has the low weight.

you either must pair two wimps or get a massive 3000. the name brand while popular doesn't offer anything short of the 3000i thats worth a dang if we start talking rooftop AC.

Well, as an update for anyone that cares, we bought the HF 2500 and it won't even turn on  our AC let alone run it. So we're pretty disappointed because it seemed really promising. It runs well and we love how quiet it is, however that does nothing for us at this point.

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36 minutes ago, Totem said:

You've stepped, alas , into the non Honda vs Honda generator war in this thread, as I'm sure you can tell.

All I can tell you is that I got sick of the emotional farce and taped my adventures this summer in 98 degree heat in NC, TN and Virginia among onther states in the smokies and Appalachians. My setup ran great and it wasnt a Honda. My HF Predator is over 3 years old now and has run my deer camp for days on end. Never failed to start on first pull. Believe me, I beat the crap out of it and its tough as nails. We've left our dog with it running for periods and its never let us down..

 

Oh yes, I've noticed! And I'm currently neutral in this generator war, I'm just appreciating all the information! Been checking out different reviews for the predator and it is seeming like it might be the one! Good to know you haven't had any problems with it too, especially with leaving your dog

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33 minutes ago, Back East Don said:

Brynn&Cas  Now you see why I don't participate in these discussions.  That and I don't carry a generator or have an AC.  I live up north and camp by the cool ocean so my opinion really doesn't apply.  Best of luck to you but you have at least saved yourself from buying an undersized genny.  That we pretty much all agree on.  Pretty much not much else from there. 

Hey, welcome to the forum.  One big happy dysfunctional family.

Bahaha! Thanks for the welcome Don! And yes, I can very much understand not wanting to get involved.  

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1 minute ago, jjrbus said:

When you go to the Harbor Freight website they show reviews, they are set up so that you read the good reviews, poke around and make sure to read the bad reviews also.

Are they quiet? Quiet is very subjective, what you consider quiet I would find horribly loud!  If I were buying the HF genset I would be sure to get the extended warranty!   HTH  Jim

If I did buy it I was defiantly going to be getting the warranty!! And thank you for the heads up, I will certainly look at more reviews then just that. The last thing we need is to buy another piece of crap! haha

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18 minutes ago, jjrbus said:

There was a rcent

Thanks for the compliment, greatly appreciated.   

There was a thread lately on pet's and some campgrounds not allowing dogs to be left alone in RV, that might be of some interest to you.

Good luck  Jim

I will be checking that thread out! Thank you for the heads up! And for the luck, we're going to need it!

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12 minutes ago, Totem said:

There are plenty of 2500 watt plus units that are quiet like this. HF is just one option, but I rather fancy the yamaha 2800 Maineh mentioned. I went with the predator because it was easy to walk over to a HF put my hands one it and its light weight. If I was gonna buy Japanese toyota like quality I would get the 2800 Yamaha for sure.

Yeah, Yamaha seems nice, however, out of our price range. And I do like the sound of light weight! Though by the sounds of it we would still need to upgrade our ac unit, right? All your guy's input is greatly appreciated!!

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5 hours ago, Totem said:

I'll trump opinions with fact. I have the Harbor freight 2500 watt inverter JDE shows above and a 11,000 BTU rooftop and am the only person in the forum to prove an effective working system ; showing it running my ac while my RV is driving on video in various states, altitudes and environments. It kept our german shep happy in 98 degree heat. Other people have made claims in here about hondas etc but none ran them while driving successfully. If its 98 degrees your rig will still be hotter than that while moving even with the windows open.. so do your dog a favor and get a generator AC combo that is proven.

To the OP:

you do not mention what your current generator is; is it built in? If its not built in and is just a carry on generator is it going into overload mode? if so its "running" but is not producing power to the outlets on it anymore. It does this to protect its circuits and means your generator is undersized.

I would avoid the honda 2000's like the plague. they are $1000 and we have had people team up two of them in here and still not get them running reliably.

Engineering is the 3 F's form fit and function. just looking cool and being light weight are only 2.

 

you may see more actual real life application of the HF unit in action in the challenge:

I'm really interested in checking out the harbor freight generator, and I wll most certainly check out your other thread. I really just want to make sure my pup is okay, though he does seem to handle 90 degree weather fine as long as he had some shade, but anyways. The generator is not built in, it is a carry on generator. And it does seem to be doing just that, going into overload mode and then after that nothing is powered just like you said. So it seems like what you guys have all recommended. New AC or new higher powered generator.

Is the harbor freight one fairly quiet? Honestly that's what turned me onto the Honda because our coleman (besides not being able to run the ac) is very loud.

 

 

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6 hours ago, Maineah said:

If you want quiet and quality you will have to pay for it, the Honda 3000 watt would fit the bill but they are pretty big and heavy. The cheap inverter generators are really quiet when they are not doing much but when they are loaded down they run pretty much full tilt and are about as noisy as a cheap open frame one. I was parked about 100' away from a Roybi 2200 watt inverter generator they were running their AC I had to get up and turn the noisy thing around so that the exhaust was pointing the other direction. I bought a Roybi 2000 watt a few years ago and returned it the same day in 20 minutes it leaked out over half it's oil from the crank seal. Me I would buy a Yamaha 2800 watt yes they are the price of a used car but if you want quiet and dependability there is not much out there that will run your AC properly for cheap money. If you are the only one camping then enjoy your noise with a cheap one.

Those Yamahas are sadly out of our price range at the moment  and I agree with the Honda 3000 being too heavy for us, I feel like we have enough weight as it is and should be looking to get rid of some! And from what little research I have done I haven't really heard any good things about the Roybi's so I plan on steering clear of those. Thanks for your input!

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7 hours ago, jdemaris said:

Why do you think switching to the smaller, less powerful Honda generator is an upgrade?  One possible variable here is if your Coleman is not really putting out what it should. I doubt it though. My experience with the Coleman Pulse and Powermates is they are noisy but work well.  One "by ear" test is if the generator sounds like it works hard before it trips the breaker? If not, maybe the breaker is worn out.  In ref. to soft-start kits - from tests I've read - the Supco is pretty worthless, but the Dometic works well (and is also very expensive). 

The reality is - a 13,500 AC unit can draw near 8000 watts for a fraction of a second when first starting, and level out to 1800-2100 watts when running.   How can you expect a Honda rated for 1600 watts to run that well?  I think the smallest on-board generators ever sold to use in these RVs were rated 2500 watt continuous and over 3000 watts surge.  Seems you either need a smaller AC unit, or a bigger generator.  I'd pick the Harbor Freight or a Hyundai if it was up to me.

Thanks for the info! Like I replied to jjrbus I had misunderstood the specs as we're totally newbies so this. Looks like that predator is a pretty good deal! I will have to check it out.