MontanaChinook

Yeah. Part of my hesitation of moving on to a newer vehicle in general. Just when I feel comfortable doing practically anything to my 20R...I jump ahead 2 decades in technology...electronics and various other complications. Oh well.

I know nothing about working on diesels...

Too bad the minis aren't one ton anymore. Well, the guy with the 2001 2.7 stopped answering my texts and emails, and pulled the ad. So at this point it's a pretty easy decision. Though I will be starting to look into domestics. I think Toyota is still the best option, but paying $7,000 for a truck with 190,000 miles just seems a little crazy. I just don't know the reliability of Fords and Chevys that would be cheaper than that, with better gas mileage and towing capacity. Looks like more research...For the time being, I'm done with early-90s and earlier trucks. I'll go back to one of those as a toy, or daily driver when I'm more stationary. But for now I need something to get me around all over the place for a few years and pull a trailer. I mean when was the last time Toyota made a one ton? Other than brand new stuff like the Tundra, which isn't happening for me (I would guess you can the Tunrda in a one ton...)

I will absolutely be selling it if I go through with this. There would be a lot to talk about. Everything I did to it works, all systems work. But I'm no carpenter, especially no finish carpenter, and everything I did, I did with the idea that I would be the only one who had to worry about it, as I never thought I'd sell it. So some of the work is far from professional. But yes, if you're serious, we can talk more and I can send a lot of photos and you can just ask any question you want. I'll send you a pm with my email and phone number.

Ah, I thought all Toyota rvs were rear frame extensions, didn't realize many (most?) were cut in the middle. Thanks. Interesting. Well, the guy with the 2001's last text to me was "I'll do you a favor and say this truck wasn't meant for towing"... I mean, not sure it isn't REALLY stupid to buy a truck that the seller is trying to talk me out of buying. Why push my luck? But it's all so relative...I mean in the same threads you'll see people who say they regularly towed 4,000lbs with their 22RE (2.4), and people like Linda's friend who say 2500lbs would be the limit for a 2.7. I mean would anyone tell you that a 2.2L 4 cylinder should be pulling as much weight as my Chinook, or a Sunrader etc? But here it is, 35 years later. But I'd sure like more power and braking power than my Chinook has. Anyway, good stuff to hear. Sounds like the 2.7 would pull the kind of trailer I want, but be slow. I'm used to that. The 3.4 may not have any beefier brakes than the 2.7 (?), so safety with braking is the same. Gas mileage may or may not be better with the 2.7, depending on who you ask. So...I think it'll come down to whether this guy even really wants to sell me his truck, which I'm starting to question, and how a test drive goes if I can get him to go that far. My friends 3.4, extended cab TRD package truck will sure be easier to buy. Just sitting in a garage waiting for me to get up to town and test drive, and mine if I want it.

Toyota didn't do the stretching, but I take your point. Ok, thanks. I did a lot of internet research, and it seems that the 2.7L 4 cylinder really only gets a couple mpg higher than the 3.4. And adding towing to that...might the 3.4 still be in its abilities, where the 2.7 would be struggling and drop more in mpg? The 3.4 also has a higher safe towing capacity. The threads I've been reading have touted the 3.4 as a better engine in terms of reliability. "No known issues" are a statement I've seen multiple times. No one has said a word about head gasket issues. The 2.7 seems to crack exhaust manifolds (no big deal if you take care of it) and some seem to get premature piston slap. But still people are clocking nearly 300,000 miles on them, and they're still pretty young engines. I really want the regular cab 4 cylinder. I'm just not sure if I'm being stupid/blind by taking it over a truck I've known since new, which is better set up for towing. I can see myself towing about 40% of the time. Other times, truck will be a DD. But the guy is claiming 19mpg highway, 16 town. I think my friends 3.4 gets the same mileage... I'd be more comfortable working on the 2.7, though

Sitting under a bit of an early winter!

I hear those double cabs had pretty sketchy frame extensions. I mean so do a lot of our toyhomes, but it seems like an extension hanging off the back of the truck is less prone to catastrophic failure than one right in the middle of frame, which required cutting the frame in half. Now I'm having to decide between my friends 98 3.4 V6 and a 2001 2.7 4 cylinder with the same mileage! All I reall want is a simple, regular cab 4x4 with a 4 cylinder. The 2001 is perfect. But the V6 has a 1,500lb higher towing capacity, and obviously more power. But really, I won't be towing all that often...Have to take the guys word for the condition, though. I know the whole history of my friends truck. But I don't need the extended cab V6 TRD package...I just want a simple regular cab 4 cylinder! A little over $2,000 cheaper, too...

I'll add it to my list. Looks like the fiberglass campers rarely come up and when they do, they go fast. But I guess I'm used to that sort of thing. If the right one came up I'd go ahead and buy it, but I'm not planning to look seriously until early spring. Lots of research to do before then, if I want to get the best suited one for me...

No, it actually seems like some of the best fiberglass campers where/are coming out of Canada.

I'll check them out! This is what I want, but is definitely too expensive, and really, probably too nice for me. It lacks the feeling of being able to tear something out and put a workbench in its place... http://olivertraveltrailers.com

Nice. Almost look like it's going to hit the cows and fake buffalo

Very interesting! WME, no 5th wheel for me, though I've seen a couple 5th wheel Scamps out there. The Tacoma doesn't have the 5th wheel hitch, but it does have a nice topper than I plan on keeping. I'm not going to cut a hole in the bed and ditch the topper. Pretty interesting ideas, Karin...I can't decide if I want another project. But in a straight-sided box trailer...everything would be much easier. The Chinook didn't have a straight line in it. Well, truck first. Then seen how things go over the winter. I figure in the spring I'll know a little better what I'll be doing for work, and can justify the money for a trailer, whether I buy a camper or build one. Building a custom one does have all the benefits you point out, with work benches and specialty needs. Thanks.

Yeah pretty cool. I'll include those in my search. Thanks!

Great. Yeah White Suphur is a cool, but depressed area. Not much money there. Most people seem to be struggling a bit.

I'll look into it, but still leaning far away from RVs. Airstreams are cool; guess I just assume they're out of my price range. And maybe a little more on the radar as far as people knowing what they're worth and targeting them? I'm definitely considering a 60s or 70s 16-17' all metal trailer, that could be easily gutted and rebuilt however I like it. Haven't looked into the weight of those or anything like that, though. They'd be cheap upfront. Then I'd just need to keep my rebuild costs down. We'll see.

Yes, I will be solo, with my dog, 90% of the time. I don't plan to be pulling the camper in the snow. Truck campers are nice, but not large enough, considering the size truck I want. A pre-2005 Tacoma just won't hold a large enough camper for me. It solves the 4x4 problem, but not the size problem. The only time I'd be pulling the trailer in snow is getting out of Montana, on I-15, in November to head down south. If the roads are bad enough to get stuck, I'll just wait a few hours until they plow them. If I spend winters in Montana it'll be in a house, cabin or yurt somewhere, with the camper either at a friends or in storage. My friends have pre-'05 Tundras, closer to the size of the T100s, with pop-up truck bed campers. Really nice, really convenient, can go pretty much anywhere the truck would be able to go without the camper in them. But to live in for months at a time? Nope. My Chinook still felt a little roomier. I'm very particular about what I feel comfy in. Many campers and RVs just don't feel like home to me, and I need to feel at home in my home. It takes the right layout and feeling. And I'm not about to buy a Tundra, or any full size truck. You can say all you want about fuel economy in larger trucks, and you're right, but I just don't want that much truck. T100s are too big for me, though I could probably get used to it. I don't trust Fords. Or Chevys. I've driven them all; Ford, Chevy and Dodge for work, and though I like things about each of them, and like Chevy/GMC the most, I still don't feel totally comfortable driving all over the country and miles down dirt roads in them. I'm just perfectly comfy and happy in nothing bigger than a Tacoma. If I get the state job, which would mean regular employment and consistent paychecks for the next 4-5 years, I'll likely be going with the Tacoma and a 17' Scamp or Casita or something similar. An Oliver would be awesome...but we're getting into amounts of money that I could actually buy a few acres of land with. I think with the truck and camper I could be in the $10-12k range. Where a Surander that didn't need to be gutted would cost me nearly $10k, and probably still need some work. Not that money has really been much of a part of this discussion. But it's obviously something I'm thinking about.

What brought you through White Sulphur Springs? Just taking the scenic route? Cool area, but not much there, other than a great music festival in July, created by a woman who makes awesome (but super expensive) female work clothes (think carhartts for women). Red Ants Pants Sounds like a great trip.

While I see that with how I've been talking here, you would come to that conclusion: no. I haven't decided until I've decided. My mind just kind of works this way. I get on a tangent, talk a lot about it, bounce the idea off of people, then let it settle for a while and see how their input compares to what I want and have thought. And though I did feel a bit prickly at first about someone telling me what I've decided...I'm over it You're right to make that statement based on what I've posted, and depending on how I read your post, it's actually pretty nice and supportive, so that's how I'll take it. Yes, so far, I see no stand out reasons why a truck/trailer would be the wrong choice for me. So for the sake of discussion, yes, at this point that's where my head is. I'm still open to ideas of why it wouldn't be right. But all the good ideas against it that I've heard are more personal-choice, personal circumstance kind of stuff. However until I make an arrangement with someone to buy something, nothing is decided. I've talked to my friend with the truck, and a person with a 21' Sunrader so far today, and neither of them got a yes or no answer from me. A trailer will be annoying. Yes. I've considered an American made vehicle. More power with still good (possibly better) gas mileage, probably half the price with half the miles. But when it comes down to it, the only truck I really trust to get me anywhere in this country or beyond, with practically no worries, is a Toyota truck. Especially one whose history I've known and been involved with since it rolled off the showroom floor. My traveling will actually be pretty tame. I'm pretty ready to settle down. Just on my own terms. I hope to do all my work in Montana, and be fairly stationary for the summer season. Caretaking a cabin up in the mountains for the winter would be ideal. Even better than heading south. For now I just don't care for rent or a mortgage. So that'll mean moving around a bit, but I'll keep it a minimum, then hopefully some somewhat small number of years I'll be able to afford a small amount of acreage in the mountains somewhere, put up a yurt, then start building a house Yep, I'm that guy.

Yeah I'm just using terms generically, though I like that definition. I just mean it seems like most people living out of their campers are living in RVs, rather than trailers. Two options I'm currently looking at are contract field work, so being my own business, taking contracts for field data collection for scientific research and projects, or a 4-5 year, 9 month a year position with state government doing streamflow measurements, rancher relations and fish studies. Benefits of full time work with a seasonal lifestyle and only a 5 year commitment. That work would be in a very rural Montana valley, so to save money I could probably find a free place to park a camper or RV to live out of for the summer. Then possibly head south for the winters, or find a cheap place to rent in Montana for the winter. Then take things from there, as I'm sure either of those will lead to more contacts and either job offers or ideas of what sorts of work to go after.

Thanks everyone. Yeah, my particular circumstances are calling for a truck with a trailer, it seems. I lose the cool factor of the old classic tiny rv, but I'm pretty sick of being cool, to tell you the truth. I can deal with a trailer. I can back them, though I'm more in the camp of "do everything possible to not have to back it" for now, since I just don't have much experience yet. With experience, I'd be fine, though I'd still try to set up the situation so I could pull through rather than have to back. I don't really want two vehicles, which I'd get with a giant rv and a car behind it. Maintenence x2 for everything. So in my mind anyways, not the best of both worlds. Aside from that, my world view and image of myself just won't allow it. I do my best not to judge gigantic rv owner. To each thier own. But it's not for me. My friend is selling a 1998 V6 4x4 Tacoma; 2nd owner, and I've know both owners and the truck since it was brand new. That and a under-20'-trailer is what I'm thinking right now. One thing I remember noticing at the RV show I went to over the winter was that rvs are, in general, cramped. Even ones bigger than my Chinook by a lot felt just stuffed full of too much stuff, with poor layouts. The few camp trailers I walked into were somehow very different. Very roomy and homey. Not sure why. But I feel I can get a 17-20' pull behind that feels as spacious as a 21' Sunrader, and be able to drive my truck away from it. I drive in the winter, and I also drive down crazy mountain and desert roads. It feels like so much more freedom to be able to drive from my campsite way out in the desert, to a trailhead for a hike, instead of being stuck just hiking from the front door of my rv every day. I sometimes park the Chinook for 5 days at a time, 30 miles down a dirt road. Would be cool to be able to jump in the truck and explore a bit. We'll see. I'm not done deciding yet. There seems to be something more legitimate about doing business with a person with a nice truck and camp trailer, rather than a guy living out of his rv, somehow. So I'll admit that image comes into this a little bit. Someday when I have a house and just take weekend camp trips or week long trips, I'll probably be looking for a little rv again. But at least as of right now, I'm leaning pretty far toward the truck/trailer combo. I think it just fits my current lifestyle much better. Yes, Nomad is more like it, but like JDs photos, I've also seen quite a few straight up homeless people living in rvs. But not so much trailers. I guess not everyone has a truck which can pull a trailer, as was mentioned. But there's something about an rv...summer road trips, cross-country trips...people always think RV, not pull trailer, for whatever reason.

Well, I don't consider a trailer a vehicle, I guess. And in Montana anyways, you can just permanently register a trailer. So one time and you're done. A truck and trailer will cost me slightly more upfront. But then I won't have to deal with buying and selling cars for the seasons that I settle down in places. I'm still talking with one 18' Sunrader seller and one 21' seller. Just don't want to spend the money before I decide which way I really want to go... Then figure out what I can get for the Chinook, since it'll be getting sold either way.

Thanks. Just another response because I don't want to make it seem like my mind is made up and I'll just shoot down any thought contrary to what I'm thinking. I just suddenly have a lot of good reasons, specific to my current lifestyle, that say to me "truck and trailer". But as I'm thinking that, I'm in a fairly serious discussion with this guy http://portland.craigslist.org/grg/rvs/5216003249.html I want to hear reasons that might talk me out of it, if they exist. I definitely want to weigh both sides. But the idea of kind of "having it all"...having my home on wheels, but being able to "detach" when I get to town and be a normal person sounds great to me. I've driven the Chinook around different towns enough that, while I kind of like the attention, the thought of having a normal vehicle and not drawing so much attention sounds really nice. Anyway, if you have good ideas for why an rv is better, keep them coming. Thanks

Thanks a lot for those replies. Really good points in both. A trailer is pretty easy to lock up though, so it can't be slolen so easy, right? Can't you lock the hitch? Locks can be cut, but still...I mean I broke into my chinook with a pen knife one day when I locked myself out...anything is going to be more secure than it. But it's true that I'm never too far away from the rv, where I could foreseably be away from a pull behind for a day or two or more. The Chinook is very un-secure, though. None of this is an argument it's just a response to what people write, so I can have a good discussion on the finer points of both, for my particular circumstances. Feel free to shoot down my ideas with any facts or opinions you have, and I'll do the same to you Linda's setup works well for her, but I will be travelling a bit. I live where there is snow in the winter. I canNOT drive my Chinook around, or any RV, in a Montana winter. I just won't do it. So I'm stuck. Last winter and this summer I had to buy vehicles. A cheap Mazda to get me around last winter in MN. This summer I bought back the Subaru I used to own and sold to a friend, so I could drive the 1hr of dirt road I need to drive to get to pavement. It's a 2 hour drive for me right now to buy groceries. Doing that in the Chinook, or a Sunrader...man that would suck. So far, in my mind, there is nothing I could do with the Chinook that I can't do with a trailer (other than, as Cheif says, climbing from the driver seat to the coach, which I actually do all the time, and I'd really miss that). But there is a ton I could do with a trailer and truck that I can't do with the Chinook. The only drawbacks I see are: the advantage of being able to drive away from my home does leave my home more vulnerable. I have to pull a trailer. I cannot walk straight from the driver seat to the coach without going outside. Any others?

It's been my experience that people living out of their campers live in rvs, not pull-behind campers (including myself). Why is this? What's the benefit? I'm starting to think about my near future, probably the next decade, and thinking of the lifestyle I'll want, and it might involve quite a bit of having to live real cheap, so a camper is great. But my Chinook is just too small for me to make a true lifestyle out of this. I've started figuring, over the past couple years, that an 18' Sunrader would be perfect. But the more I think, and actually seriously look, the 21' models seem more common, AND less expensive. And I'll tell you, though I really don't like the idea of driving and owning such a large rv, the space would be really, really nice. I mean I'd be living out of it for stretches of time, not camping in it, so much. I've come close...I mean I'm actually calling and emailing people with them for sale, checking my back account, etc., looking to make it happen. Then the thought hits me...why not a 4x4 Toyota truck and a pull-behind? That way when I do end up in a town, possibly working, with a place to stay (especially in the winter), I have a 4wd vehicle. Rather than a 2wd rv being my only vehicle. And suddenly it all just makes so much more sense. What I'm afraid of is that there's some giant blind spot in my head of "THIS is why that wouldn't work for you". But I can't come up with anything. I mean I love rvs, and Sunraders and Chinooks. But for a guy who will be moving around a bit, not wanting to pay rent, but sometimes having housing and needing to get around to get groceries and all that stuff (especially in the winter), doesn't that make much more sense? There's no road, down in the desert where I love spending so much time, which I wouldn't be able to get down in a 4wd Toyota with a small pull-behind, but that I could get down with the Chinook. So I could get to all the same places. It makes sneaky urban camping a bit more tough, but probably not really...because again, everyone seems to understand that the guy living out of his camper down the street is in an RV, not a pull behind. So I actually think I'd attract less attention...maybe (?) Any thoughts? I think if the right 18' Sunrader at the right price came along I'd still get it, but I'm leaning more towards a truck and trailer....Crazy