danny dan
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Posts posted by danny dan
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It can be done, but the frames are entirely different as others have mentioned. 2wd frames have welded in transmission cross members, while 4wd frames have bolt in cross members. All the front steering & brake components, diff mount are different, you'll also need to match gear ratios. A solid axle swap would be easier than trying to IFS it. Lots of guys have converted 2wd trucks to 4wd. If you have more time than money go for it. On a side note, there is no way I'd want to off-road (even mildly) a huge glued together RV. They creak and sway enough going down the road as it is.
I built a 4wd Chinook using roughly three trucks to make one. I can tell you first hand that I spent at least two months on frame fab work alone, working on my days off or after work. Every cab mount, spring hanger, gas tank mount, wiring, etc had to be changed. Custom drive shaft, custom springs, brake lines, fuel lines and more. I've had it out on a 4wd only beach several times and it is a beast, it just crawls. But I would never attempt taking a 21' rv out on the sands. If budget and time aren't an issue, than you'll have something unique.
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9 hours ago, gmg said:
I considered a bunch of mercedes diesels but either none of them would fit, or I would be the first one attempting the swap. I wanted something that was tried and true with an adapter plate to mate engine to toyota transmission which limited my options. Again the ALH was the best tdi ever made by VW. Not many major issues with these engines.
10-4. There is a local guy here with a later Mercedes (1999 model) diesel in his 94 T100. Others swap the older Mercedes om617 into Toyotas trucks & 4runners. Anyway diesels are sweet. Have fun.
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Nice rig. Not an attempt to steal from your thread, just wanted to share. You have some serious skills man. Here is a pic of my 4wd Chinook I built a few years back. Have logged several thousand miles up and down the East Coast. I'm not brave enough to travel in Mexico however.
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I say go for it. Did you consider a Mercedes Inline 6 diesel? Later ones can be budget tuned to around 230hp +/- as well. Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but I think the 1.9 TDI had some crank pulley wobble issues among other things. Either way, engine swaps are cool, have fun.
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On 5/4/2018 at 1:58 PM, Eric Day said:
My factory Kohler 2.5CMZ generator has been acting up...I believe the carb is gummed up. I bought a new one, and now on closer inspection it seems like the entire generator might have to be removed to get the carb out...hope I'm wrong. Anyone have experience removing their carb?
You should be able to just unbolt the intake manifold/carb/airbox as an assembly and pull it out. I believe you have the same setup as my Itasca.
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22 hours ago, ednelson100 said:
Very nice and neat looking job Dan.
I wonder who will be next?
Thanks Ed - I certainly benefited from reading through this thread before I started. Thank you.
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Obviously this one will never run again, but here's that example of a timing belt that suffered extreme heat. Unbelievably, the belt is still intact.
I'm gonna wager that Totem will argue that a timing belt under the hood of a Toyota camper will never survive heat though...
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51 minutes ago, Totem said:
I love being called a hater when i have not hated on anything, and i also thank you for agreeing with my points. i think your bias is showing and also Maineah, you are both backed into an emotional corner because you own V6s and are rationalizing some kind of superiority complex that other less biased people like Derek, WME and I would readily call BS on. You continue to state you've never seen something as a logical argument for providing something is true and Maineah I am going to just say it... you haven’t changed a 22re chain so please spare us the 2.5 day procedure claim unless you can hash out why And of course this is not an ifs 4x4 the context is a standard toy home ( again i have to take you two out of the yota crawler truck site hypnosis you seem to be getting all your information from.)
so lets just round this up and go back to what would be best for someone who wants to have a shop do the work as well maintain the vehicle as the OP of the case in point context small crux we are in stated he was.. you are advising him to swap a non standard issue motor and all the other things including custom mount fabrications at a shop instead of a built bolt on 22re? Man with advice like that i would hate to see how you treat your enemies.
Lol. You are indeed a hater. You troll on posts. You are the definition of a troll. It seems to me like you haven't turned many wrenches in your time judging from your posts. I happen to own both variants in multiple platforms so I'm very familiar with both of these engines. You, on the other hand own one variant. I assume you've had little to no experience with the 3.4 platform, so I find it hard to understand why you're so biased. I'm not going to preach anymore than I already have. You obviously won't listen to anyone but yourself. You just like to argue and make a point to try and get the last word in. I've quietly read many of your posts for several years. You are, for the most part uninformed on many levels, specifically mechanics. You remind me of all the kids who watch Youtube and read about internet repairs, yet they've no firsthand experience. Internet keyboard warriors who like to talk a lot. What's best for you might not be the best for someone else and vice versa. Let people make their own decisions based on their personal choice. Who are you to judge what engine should be swapped or not? Get off it man.
Btw, I've also read many of Maineah's post on this forum as well as another. He is very informed and seems to have a broad knowledge of these trucks.
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1 hour ago, WME said:
Everyone is acting like changing the timing chain is a big deal. It takes about four hours with the right tools. If it's an emergency you can hillbilly a change in about 30 min
I could possibly do a timing chain in 4 hours with some help, scraping gaskets, cleaning parts, etc. There is no way in the world I could do one in 30 mins though and I've done a LOT of them...
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On 4/26/2018 at 11:47 AM, Totem said:
Fascinating, so now its Chain recommendation is by sound or not at all and Belt at 60,000 miles per Derek and we have Maineah in the background saying something about belts being easier to work on than chains which may just be because they are done more often. yet no one is disputing the vast amount of Rigs (in this site) that have 22s in them with over 200k miles applied to them from factory. How many 3.4's with toy home chasis in here again that had their miles applied in them?
This is looking better by the minute for sticking with a 2x series motor, Of which I prefer the 22re personally. Cult like following aside, I have mine doing exactly what i need it to.
So, Maineah, whats the procedure for replacing the belt in the 3.4 ? any sticky wickets there or is it just a socket wrench and some wd 40... no special tools? no timing adjustments or callibration? you have well described the 22re maintenance process. Thats good to know. funny thing is - as per observation in here, and elswhere the 22re was famous for being awesome. And of course to Dereks point its nice to get warning before failure which chains do nicely. Belts not so much. keep going this is great discussion...
22r chain rattle is just the beginning. You'll often hear a rattle on startup as the tensioner builds oil pressure. Later as the chain wears, it begins to "slap" the chain guides. Once the guides are broken they find their way down into the oil pain. Shortly thereafter, the chain wears into the timing cover develops a coolant leak. Now you have a nice frothy water/oil mix. If the bearings don't go first, the chain finally breaks. I've seen catastrophic engine damage from chain failure on the 2xr. Once you've reached this point, it is a LOT of work to get the engine back in shape (I've done it many times). A lot of folks just don't know what to listen for when this starts to happen. Others choose to ignore it.
I've never seen major damage on a 3.4 other than the crank pulley bolt coming loose on early models. Again, (since you choose to be a cheerleader for timing chains and continue to ignore what I've written), when the belt breaks, nothing bad happens, aside from having to be towed in for repairs.
Also, the 3.4 is famous for being awesome...
"How many 3.4's with toy home chasis in here again that had their miles applied in them?"
Keep on drinking that Haterade boy....
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On 4/26/2018 at 10:13 AM, Maineah said:
Totam the 22re were famous for neglect of timing chains they hammered holes in the timing case and flooded the crankcase with antifreeze trashing the bearings because oil floats on water. In order to replace a chain properly you first drop the oil pan then you remove the water pump,the timing case, the tensioner, the chain guides and don't forget the bolt behind the distributer. People that ignore maintenance are asking for trouble to my knowledge there no published interval on 22re timing chains maybe a recommendation after they found out they were beating the timing case to death. You had better think quick when it starts to rattle because it's already beating on the case grinding aluminum into the sump. Changing a belt is simple by comparison.
Exactly. Per the book, Toyota wants you to pull the head, drop the pan (PITA on IFS 4x4 models) to do the job correctly. Obviously you can just pull the timing cover without doing the aforementioned stuff, but they almost always leak afterward. Doing a timing belt, in my opinion is an easier and cleaner repair.
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On 4/26/2018 at 2:22 PM, Totem said:
i did not have a technical microfilm on it like you do, I found it on a web site somewhere. I noticed some say 90 some 105, with each person matter of factly speaking their opine on it in each case; much like we see in here. In the end 60k miles is even far less than what I generously gave it. Thank you for that! I think you will state for the record that it is in fact NOT over 200,000 miles.
I never stated that the 3.4 timing belt service interval was 200k. I simply mentioned that there are countless reports of 3.4 owners who for whatever reason, went a VERY long time with no timing belt service. The last 3.4 timing belt job I did had over 200k with no belt maintenance. Truck serviced at 341k - last timing belt change was at 139k by Toyota. I know the owner. I would never personally wait that long on my own vehicle, but I also wouldn't be scared to drive one that I didn't know history on either.
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On 4/26/2018 at 7:41 AM, Totem said:
Excellent to see the chain hold up that well. Well within numbers reported on belt users. I am on a rant because of a perception that the belts are somehow vastly superior to chains or have some magical property about them that makes them ok to ignore their recommended service interval any more than a chain. On an interference motor like our 22's we tend to have a mindset on proper maintenance observations but if we want to discuss longevity between the two motors I am also of the belief the 22 series is just as perfectly capable of going through a desert drought of maintenance neglect as chancing over 200k with a belt. Apparently its an un-"poop"- ular opinion... hehehehe
There is also a misconception that valve to piston interference is the only slayer of a motor when a belt or chain fails. however in many V motors the valves themselves can slap each other and grenade also even though the motor is considered non interference in its traditional sense. This is known as "valve interference". At present I am unsure if the 3.4 is one of these or not. Perhaps our nascent conversational players can update us on that.
"but if we want to discuss longevity between the two motors I am also of the belief the 22 series is just as perfectly capable of going through a desert drought of maintenance neglect as chancing over 200k with a belt."
As I mentioned a while back, I sell several trucks (all 2xr series) to Honduras, Guatemala, etc every year. These are predominantly 79-95 4x4 trucks. While not the desert, they take a lot of abuse in these countries. I'm not arguing the reliability of the little engine. In fact, I sold one that had 374k on the clock and still ran well.
I also mentioned that the 3.4 is non-interference engine a while back as well. It would be rare for 3.4 to suffer piston to valve damage in the event of a timing belt failure. I'm not saying it couldn't happen, but it would be rare.
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On 4/24/2018 at 9:41 PM, Totem said:
some more fun for dan:
http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/toyota-truck-4runner/220404-life-beyond-200k-miles-22re.html
OMG ^ wow! look at that? still means nothing to me even though its in my favor and one of your own favorite sites.
recommended maintenance interval done by licensed mech with oem VIN showing same motor as whats in it will be easier in the end can you imagine anyone else working on your 3.4 other than you now in that chassis? that's some explaining you will need to do.
??? I never said the 22re engine wasn't reliable or that it wouldn't go well into the high mileage range, so I'm not sure what you're getting at there. I simply stated that the 2xr series is more prone to maintenance and noisier by design than a 5vz engine. Honestly, I'd rather do a 3.4 timing belt than a timing chain on a 22re and I've done loads of timing chain jobs.
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On 4/26/2018 at 10:13 AM, Maineah said:
Totam the 22re were famous for neglect of timing chains they hammered holes in the timing case and flooded the crankcase with antifreeze trashing the bearings because oil floats on water. In order to replace a chain properly you first drop the oil pan then you remove the water pump,the timing case, the tensioner, the chain guides and don't forget the bolt behind the distributer. People that ignore maintenance are asking for trouble to my knowledge there no published interval on 22re timing chains maybe a recommendation after they found out they were beating the timing case to death. You had better think quick when it starts to rattle because it's already beating on the case grinding aluminum into the sump. Changing a belt is simple by comparison.
^ What he said.
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On 4/24/2018 at 5:30 PM, markwilliam1 said:
D Please don’t disrespect Totem! He’s extremely knowledgeable about Toyota MH and I’ve learned a lot from him. You I don’t know about! Thanks
No disrespect intended. Just stating the facts.
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On 4/23/2018 at 10:25 AM, Totem said:
Never stated it would be for the 22re - just educating you on the built heads of 22reperformance are in fact ported and not stock which is akin to my afore mentioned example with the 22r/20r head mod. I also disagree on the exhaust with you. The exhaust path on the toyota pickup is horribly stiff and does not flex well. For that its prone with vibration and extreme heat and thus leaks form and leaks are louder. With a well sealed exhaust path the 22re pickup is not that bad sound wise.
You're educating me? How? Certainly not grammatically. For real, learn to use some sentence structure man. Damn.
Where did I even once mention exhaust?? I'm done here. Seriously, trying to discuss technical topics with you is like trying to teach my dog to quit eating cat poop.
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On 4/23/2018 at 9:54 AM, Totem said:
Danny Dan is a self professed master mechanic that has had prior experience lighting a motor on fire to show the resilience of the belt and YES lets see those pics!
?? It came from an auction. Never said I was a master mechanic at all. Hang on, it's raining. Let me go get you a picture.
On 4/23/2018 at 9:54 AM, Totem said:ambient tester testing of parts is unfortunately though, more than that. The motor would need to be run in a hot box that simulates the duty cycle temperatures of the application. So how does the 7000 pounds of motorhome make any difference to the belt or chain ? Again, I will state my personal belief that the Toy bay will be much hotter and under more stresses than the normal environment and not its intended tested one. So in effect you putting the 3.4 in is just that. You will need to duty cycle it to failure before you can state that it will achieve any form of longevity in that application. And yes these engines are tough.
Ok, because no one ever grossly overloaded a Tacoma out in the desert with troops, guns, equipment, etc. I don't even know what you're saying man. If you're going to argue something, try and put some facts behind it. You don't even make sense. Duty cycle? Lol. I can see I'm not going to win here. It's all good. Never mind.
the 22re was applied to these motor homes so I stayed with that.
Or, not so much. The motor home was "applied" to Toyota cab and chassis platform.
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While these aren't RVs. You can bet they probably would have kept going.. All examples have over 300k miles on a 3.4 engine.
https://www.iaai.com/Vehicle?itemID=27893054&RowNumber=4&loadRecent=True
https://www.iaai.com/Vehicle?itemID=27595675&RowNumber=5&loadRecent=True
https://www.copart.com/lot/29926777
https://www.iaai.com/Vehicle?itemID=28004067&RowNumber=45&loadRecent=True
https://www.iaai.com/Vehicle?itemID=25880938&RowNumber=9&loadRecent=True
https://www.iaai.com/Vehicle?itemID=27817221&RowNumber=2&loadRecent=True
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6 hours ago, Totem said:
well a simple head change on a 20r on as in my case cams for a 22re porting etc can also be done with far less space and tinkering. To get real world practical power also with far less modifications and a shop can still work on it with a chiltons manual and not need you in there. I dont think the 22re has to be a loud motor either it just suck how still the exhaust path is and how hot it gets.
22r/20r hybrid is a good swap for seat of the pant's performance feel. 20r head on 22r block. (or bore an early 20r block to it's maximum (they have thicker casing than later 20r blocks) and then its the same thing as a 22r/20r hybrid)..) Common belief is that it raises compression. It actually just flows a whole lot better due to it's pre-emission design. It would not be a bolt on swap for your fuel injected engine due to the difference in intake manifold designs. It's been done, but not often. *CAM* - just one, in your case.
I meant loud, as in inherently noisy by design (2xr series). Turn screw/lock nut valve adjustment vs shim over bucket will always be noisier. Valve train noise, injector noise, chain rattle, make it a louder engine. Nothing to do with exhaust, just the nature of that engine.
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3 hours ago, Totem said:
Hey look, he dropped in a nice non-interference engine in a bay that most likely had a 3.0 in it to start correct? There was a lot of fabrication compared to a bolt in swap of same oem motor. All the more power to him. I congratulate the effort, but why not put a hemi or diesel and have it shoot flames on a lift kit?
The 3.0 to 3.4 engine swap is bolt in. Obviously in a 22r powered rig it would not be. But that swap has also been done countless times...
The points i am making here were in context to a guy thats bay is setup for a 22re and the fact you can slide a power band to a better place with a built 22re motor. Couple that with the built motor having better chain guides than stock and known wear points being made better -To me its better than trying to re-engineer that situation into something else. Ive seen the blog its a cool build but less space. The only thing i am not in alignment on is that belt or any belt tortured by the heat of the motor home situation holding up like a chain nor giving the warning signs before it goes. Those truck belts just arent seeing strained duty heat like these RVs. I was pleased to see the 3.4 was non interference so hes got me there though ive read many reports of 22res breaking chains and being ok no bent rods. Either way there are a heck of a lot of 22re based rigs running passed 200k in this forum in reality - truth also I am still skeptical on the claims of corvette speeds on steep slopes even with that setup. Ohhh but it could be supercharged and turbod and..
IF, the belt breaks, no harm no foul. I would never argue that fact that the 22re stuff doesn't go into the higher miles . They are a dime a dozen (which is a good thing as far as reliability goes). I guess I'm confused. Your argument is that a re-engineered 2xr engine performs better and is more reliable than a bone stock 3.4?
"Those truck belts just arent seeing strained duty heat like these RVs. " - Yes, because no one ever loaded a Toyota pickup beyond it's carry capacity and drove it around for its entire life.
In fact, I've got a completely burned up 3.0 powered truck on my property, burnt to crisp. Pop the hood and literally everything has melted away. But, GASP - the timing belt still look great. Happy to upload a picture for you.
3 hours ago, Totem said:well a simple head change on a 20r on as in my case cams for a 22re porting etc can also be done with far less space and tinkering. To get real world practical power also with far less modifications and a shop can still work on it with a chiltons manual and not need you in there. I dont think the 22re has to be a loud motor either it just suck how still the exhaust path is and how hot it gets.
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8 hours ago, Jack M. said:
There is definitely a lot to consider here. I suppose it does have a lot to do with what you want and how much time/money you have. There seems to be good reason for either building the 22 or swapping 3.4. Either seem like more practical options than swapping the truck for say, a newer Tacoma (we better not even start that conversation!).
Going faster is not the primary issue. I think 65 is a very comfortable speed or maybe 70 sometimes if possible. My daily-driver for the last 20 years has been a performance Trans Am that can climb straight up a wall without slowing down. Very fun on winding mtn roads. Anyway, I get the same thrill driving my truck at 65 as the TA at ~120. ...both hands on the wheel, watching everything, focused. I'm ready to slow down and deal with life at a reasonable pace.
...but not THAT slow. To be fair, I was having other vehicle issues when I went through the mountains. The hood got slammed shut and I was low on ATF so I tried to limp back home, then made a wrong turn into the mountains. About two days into my trip the speedo stopped working but I imagine I was only going 20-25 at the end. It would have been less dangerous if I were going the pokey 45 I was getting on hills earlier.
For me, one priority would be to fix the "goose fire poker" issue. It's just a little too nerve racking to drive when it sounds like it's about to explode. Bless it's soul with 200k+. The other thing would be power for ac/alt and hills.
Sounds like a good step might be to replace the tranny with a better one, ...which I would want for either engine option?? Perhaps gear it for better low-end and sacrifice some of that blazing speed that I get on flat ground.My 3.4 swapped Itasca will cruise at 70 easy. It will do a lot more, but I'm not that brave.
If you're sincerely looking at swaps, and liking the idea of a 4 cylinder you can find a 2rz/3rz out of a Tacoma pretty cheap. 2rz is fairly easy and inexpensive to boost with a load of aftermarket support and is reliable in the 300+/- range when boosted. Stock 3rz is good for around 150hp but not good for boost. These engines can easily see high miles without being opened up for more than a valve cover gasket.
Likewise, the 5vz is great. So is the 1uz.
None of these swaps would be without modification, but a slightly more modern obdII, distributor-less engine that makes substantially more power is always nice.
The old 22re is gonna scream going down the road, especially trying to pull a hill. The rear chunk is easy to swap out with a lower gear range. You can add an air flow meter from an 82 Supra/Cressida with a higher flow filter and exhaust and net a few more ponies. This setup does work. I ran a set of the 4 hole Bosch injectors (same as Gm 3800 if I recall) that are marketed on Ebay as "Flame Thrower Injectors) in my '93 Toyota shop truck, but honestly couldn't tell much of a difference.
Your transmission will depend on your swap choice. I'm assuming you have an A43d in your current setup, you'd only retain that if you're keeping it stock. I have at least six A43d transmission in the crate from Toyota. I've held onto them since the mid '90s but I imagine I should sell a few one day, lol. I imagine someone out there builds or at least supplies heavy duty torque converters for your trans. I know Trans-Go offers a valve body kit for the a340 trans, not sure about the a43D however.
Lastly, I want to again apologize for hijacking the thread. This was not my intention and if an admin would care to move or start a new thread, I'm on board.
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7 hours ago, Totem said:
$3700 was the motor cost. I paid additional for mechanic to install. That was nearly an additional 2k or so after odds and ends tallied up as it needed many things.
It will run up a pass much more nicely than a stock 22re but its not a corvette.
$5700 would put you in a performance 22re thats meant to do what you want it to with the rest stock (tranny etc) and still retains the bulletproof easy to maintain inline legendary 22re motor with enough room on either side that the average joe can fix anything while on a vacation with wife and kids..The 3.4? not so much and no offense to the guys that love working on that sort of motor and the fun that it entails fitting it into that bay. On the 3.4 I should like to see it cruise a mountain pass at Yellowstone (the ones that are so steep that they have pull offs for RVs) at passenger car speeds on camera, not that I am calling BS its simply physics; they are not 3x the horsepower and I should really enjoy seeing someone attempt to fit the super charger or turbo into it in that engine bay... Would be an awesome proove out to film a 3.4 going fast up a pass, because when I was there I saw as mentioned full size RVs with much more powerful motors than the 3.4 on that incline and they ALL have the snail. Pride never goes before fact with me and it lends folks to get emotional true enough so please do not take it as an insult, just an opinion based on my own observations. will a 3.4 smoke a 22re in a sunrader drag race? hell yes. Will that timing belt last 200k in that motor under that strain and heat with so little space for airflow? I would wager not. For those of us that are more familiar with timing belt blow ups and TRUTH in automotive engineering I challenge that farce for sure:
https://www.greggsauto.net/2013/07/truth-about-timing-belts/
Ok dude. It's cool. Seriously, just head on over to Pirate or Yotatech and see what others have to say about these 3.4 belts lasting... the factory belts on these are solid and will go and go. I'm not saying that's what I'd do at all, just the fact they're known to go for a long time... I just did a timing belt and water pump for a fella. He had Toyota do the timing belt and water pump on his 03 Tundra with a 3.4 at around 139k. Fast forward to 341k after LOT of highway miles, he hadn't done anything other than oil changes since then. I pulled out the factory belt, tensioner and Aisin water pump (which by the way, looked great), installed his new parts and away he went. The factory timing belt is kevlar based, literally the same material HD uses on their belt drive system. It is VERY durable. These 3.4 engines are non-interference, so if the belt goes, it's generally not a death sentence. Whereas the 2xr series, well.... I've seen plenty of those chains let loose and the aftermath isn't usually pretty.. bent, broken valves, holes in pistons, destroyed heads and more. I WILL bet you money that the 3.4 timing belt will outlast the chain, guides and tensioner in ANY 2xr series engine. As I mentioned, I've done more 2xr head gaskets, timing chain jobs than there are weeks in the year... seriously, I can have one done in less than a day, 4-5 hours with helper to scrape gaskets and clean....
I'd say I'm fairly well acquainted with the automotive world. (I taught automotive classes at a local college for several years and I've been involved in the motorsports/auto industry for the last 20). I am by no means an expert, but I do know a few things. I've built quite a few engines, but I am not a pro engine builder by any stretch. I certainly wouldn't shell out $5700 for a polished 22re, but that's just me. Heck, I probably wouldn't pay $5700 for an entire vehicle. I'm frugal and can build and fix my own stuff. No matter how fancy it was built, you or someone else will be doing a timing chain sooner than later, its the nature of the beast. Don't get me wrong, I do love those little engines, they're torquey and fun. Every year I sell a handful of 2xr truck, mainly going to Guatemala and Honduras. I'd say I might know these trucks inside and out. I have storage trailer full of nothing but 22r/e stuff (body parts, electrical, engines and half a dozen a43d transmissions brand new in crates). I hoard parts and I collect more Toyota trucks than anyone should. These little engines very are reliable when taken care of, but they're not without flaws.
BTW, the 3.4 works just fine with the stock v6 trans and actually gives a lot more work room than the 3vze that was there. My particular swap looks like it came from the factory. I don't find it hard to work on at all and I didn't have to wrestle it into place either. Just kind of plopped it on in there... Sure, there were modifications to be made, but it performs flawlessly. This is a swap that has been done a lot. Especially supercharged. It was a TRD option and fits just fine with some hood modifications.
Anyway, If you're so familiar with the automotive engineering side of things, why pay someone else all that money for a fancy 22re? You should know, in the end, it is still a 22re. My dad had a '88 Sunrader with a 22re and as reliable as she was, that thing wouldn't pull a greasy string out of a cat's behind. I'd go 2rz/3rz or 5vz in a heartbeat over dumping serious money into a 22re. Putting money into one to keep it regularly maintained and reliable? Absolutely.
"there is a reason that chain driven motors are more expensive than belt ones - they are the real million mile motors. with million mile being qualified as a defined by not having to overhaul them. Chains are not infallible either but they last far longer than belts. Again just my opine , but one backed by facts not emotion. Thats the reason I went the way I did... I simply do not enjoy working on my RV I want to drive it with the wife & kids and avoid break downs as much as possible but if one happens, I am the king of being in and out in 45 mins and back on the road. My family will back me on this. Whats my secret>? the easiest motor in the world ever to work on - a 22re in all that room of a truck bay."
Yeah..... wait, what??? No, not really.... I've done timing chains that were worn out on Flathead Mopar engines, SBC, Toyota's, Nissans, tons of motorcycle engines, etc. Most, if not all with under 150k on the clock. Chains wear, chains stretch and chains break, especially on engines with an older design (like the 2xr). Whether its on your engine, motorcycle, cheese grater, whatever. It is a highly wearable item. Very few engines in this world are million mile engines. An example of a MUCH longer lasting chain drive engine would be the newer 1nz, 2rz, 3rz engines, these guys have a better design and don't need the timing chain service the the 2xr engines do. You could easily see 300-400k on a very well maintained specimen, but never a million miles. Maybe on a very well maintained, babied, mid sized diesel engine, but even then, a million miles is pushing it.
The 3.4 didn't have the issues the 3.0 did. The 3.0 is an entirely different engine. The 3.0 was a SOHC that suffered from bad heat soak on #5 & #6 cylinders due to restrictive exhaust on the back collector and a weak bottom end. The 3.4 is an entirely different engine, DOHC, strong bottom end, modern fuel injection, etc. That being said, head gaskets can pop on anything. 2xr series for sure, just a little too much heat, first the head gasket goes then the head warps. Seen it, over and over and over and over.
7 hours ago, Totem said:side edit... it was the 3.x series 6 cylinder motors that blow the head gaskets and had the recalls in these RVS. Everyone in here knows that very well. the 22re were far more bulletproof and known mostly for wearing out water pumps or chain guides which when replaced with proper upgraded ones last "forever" (in a true 200k mile sense).
As much as I really do love these little engines, I feel as if they have garnered a cult-like following. I have certainly seen them with 300-400k on the clock, but not without having gone through several sets of timing chain/tensioners and head gaskets first. Chain gets, loose, plastic guide breaks, timing chain wears hole in cover, water goes in oil, etc. They're prone to leak and they're noisy. They are easy to work on, parts are dirt cheap and they are reliable for sure. I don't want to come off as if I'm knocking the 2xr at all. But even when addressed with a steel backed guide, the chain eventually will get loose and break if not replaced. Hence the need for more preventative maintenance. The more these little engine scream, the more the chain stretches. Race and reliability don't exactly go hand in hand. Not saying your particular engine won't be reliable for years to come and I don't doubt your engine builder's skills either, I just can't see spending all that money for 20 more hp. I'd have kept the stocker in there. But hey, as long as you're happy that's what counts.
Finally, I've lurked on this site for at least 7-8 years, this is one of the few times I've been inclined to type...
Got to go. Feeling the need to research the TRUTH in automotive engineering...
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23 minutes ago, Jack M. said:
I definitely respect the opinions of you guys who have actually done these things! Thanks. A motor swap is too big of a project for me so I'll have to take the long way around (pay). I'm glad to hear that swap wasn't too hard and it's working out good for you. Sounds like a good option.
You had to swap the tranny too, right?It wasn't too bad, it probably isn't for the faint of heart though, especially the wiring. It works great. OBDII diagnostics, better fuel injection system, etc. I used the trans that was already in the Itasca, only because it had less mileage, no other reason. Building the one that came out of my donor as a spare. You would need to swap the trans and move engine mount location on yours. among other things...
Apologies, didn't mean to hijack this thread, carry on.
Official Toyota head gasket recall documents
in Engines - Transmissions - Drive Train - Suspension - Chassis - Steering - Exhaust - Tires - Etc.
Posted · Edited by danny dan
Just to let any folks who might be wondering about the HG replacement, the campaign is still available for those with affected VIN numbers. I purchased another '90 Itasca with 60k on the clock for the purpose of reselling. I dropped it off at my local Toyota dealer last week and they finished up today. It didn't have any issues and ran just fine, I just figured, why not? I also let them take care of the timing belt & water pump while they were in there (this was obviously not covered by the campaign, but was worth doing while everything was apart). Check your VIN numbers, you never know. My local dealer didn't balk at all, they were happy to do it. After all, they're getting warranty pay from Toyota.