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Window gaskets


MontanaChinook

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Exterior window gaskets. The rubber ones. They have hardened and shrunk, so in each corner you can see them pulling away frome the frame, out onto the visible surface of the windows. They're out a good 3-4" from the corners, where they should be. I don't know how much of a difference they make structurally for the window, or water sealant wise, but it seems not good that they're pulling away.

Anyone replaced theirs? I'm probably only doing this if it doesn't require taking the windows out. I was going to just start pulling on them, and see if they came out, and then if I could find a replacement....but figured a little research would be good before I just start digging in.

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Think they might look like one of these.

http://www.all-rite.com/advanced_search_result.php?search_in_description=1&keywords=glazing+bead&Submit.x=17&Submit.y=12

I replaced all the glazing bead on my Tiger Provan. Easy job. easier if you soak it in hot soapy water first. snaps right in another possibility is that it's screw cover trim.

http://www.all-rite.com/screw-covers-trims-c-52.html

Still easy job. Prices on these things can often be found cheaper on ebay once you figure out the right size. Local rv store should have them too so you can make sure size is right

Linda S

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Great! Thanks. Yeah, looking at that site after reading the weep hole thread is what really got me thinking. It would be great if they just came out, and new ones pushed in.

attachicon.gifIMG_1226.JPGattachicon.gifIMG_1227.JPG

Yes they just come out and new ones push in. you can pour hot soapy water on the old ones too to help get them out. Only important thing is to get the right ones

Linda S

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Warning "Cheap Carlie" move to follow. Remove one of the smaller window trims. Push the rest of the window trims back into place this will leave a gap in the trim, so cut the old trim to fit the gap. Buy new trim for one window instead of all the windows. The advantage to this is that the old trim is preshrunk and will not pull away again.

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The trim I removed from my 1993 Tiger Provan was dried up and hard. I would not recommend keeping trim like that. It takes years for that trim to dry enough to shrink like that. Montana's Chinook is a 78 and that might be the original trim. He needs new stuff

Linda S

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I'm curious to see how you make out. My Chinook had the same problem. I pushed in what was there tight and then closed the big gaps with a RTV compound (room temperature vulcanizing compound). New gaskets would of been nicer, but the old ones are rock hard and I figured I might do more damage trying to change them. As they are, they are fine as long as they stay stabile. Even my back door window had the problem in my Chinook.

One of my front upper curved fixed windows is a checkerboard full of cracks and I don't want to touch it unless I can find a good, new replacement. I was considering curving my own Lexan, but I'm not very skilled at it. I recently made my own curved boat windshield and ruined my first sheet of Lexan.

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The trim is not the seal it just holds the window in place. There is a sealing compound between the window and the frame. So old trim is OK

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Yes, but it is a gasket, holding the window in place.

Might not make a difference, but unless it's really expensive (which it doesn't look like), I don't see much reason not to replace them. So much is going to be new on this thing, it doesn't seem right to have old cracked, shrunken, hard gaskets.

I think if I had just bought this thing and used it "as-is", your suggestion would be a great one. As it is...it's getting a pretty serious make-over.

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Yes, but it is a gasket, holding the window in place.

Might not make a difference, but unless it's really expensive (which it doesn't look like), I don't see much reason not to replace them. So much is going to be new on this thing, it doesn't seem right to have old cracked, shrunken, hard gaskets.

I think if I had just bought this thing and used it "as-is", your suggestion would be a great one. As it is...it's getting a pretty serious make-over.

All depends on your specific situation. I replaced the rubber gasket on the back door window on my Chinook and I would never do it again. At least, I'd never do it just because the original rubber molding shrunk.

Note before someone gets upset - I'm not advising you or anyone else what to do, or what NOT to do. I am simply relating my own experience with my Chinooks (I have three).. All seem to have Hehr windows. Fixed in front and back and sliders on the sides.

The window frames are riveted and sealed together.

To replace the molding on the sliders that hold the glass into the perimeter frame . . ,

I had to totally remove the windows from the RV. If I tried to remove the hardened rubber in place, it would of been easy to break a window. Besides, if I DID get it out, I'd never get the new molding back in this way.

Once out, the rivets holding the window frame together have to be drilled out.

Then spread/break the seam,

Then spread the OD of the aluminum perimeter until the glass and molding and be removed.

I did one window and found it was a lot of work for very little gain. Loosening up the old and shrunk molding, tucking it in, and then sealing the gap worked fine for me. When done, I see NO functional difference.

The rubber was not rock hard. Just not as soft as new and shrunk. No window could or possibly fallen out.

In my case, with my Hehr windows, in my Chinooks - there was no way to replace those molding without window disassembly.

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Interesting...

It seems like we can see from the photos that my windows and gaskets are a little different...

But you're basically saying - if I get the gaskets out, I have a good chance of breaking a window, but even if I get them out ok, I won't be able to get new ones back in?

If my windows are the same as yours.

Linda it sounds like you've done this before? What's your take?

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If you do decide to replace them and you do it right, I'm sure you will have a sense of accomplishment and peace of mind that you won't have to do it again in your lifetime. These old rv's just need a little love and maintenance. Thanks for the picture, It really helped me understand.

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OK I did have some trouble getting some of them out. That's why I softened them with hot soapy water. Kept dipping a towel in a bucket and soaking the gaskets. I had 2 windows that were leaking between the glass and the frame. Use Captain tollys creeping crack sealer on them and they are fine now. need to do it in warm weather and with window sitting flat on a table. Then installed rubber seal and reinstalled window. The non leaking windows I installed the rubber gaskets with the window in place. Pop it in and cut with razor at the end. Diagonal cuts where the ends come together. Come on guys. I'm an old lady and this isn't rocket science.

Linda S

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:lol2:

Ok. I also think that the early Chinooks did some things "different", and my Newport model is a little more in line with a typical motorhome. I might be missing something, but those photos I saw of JDs don't look like my windows or gaskets. I think he might have something different going on.

If I can do it with the windows in place, I'll be doing it. I don't want to remove the windows...now would be the time, since the thing is still gutted right now, but the windows have actually been my biggest problem area.

All the screws are corroded, but especially the ones along the inside bottom of the window frames. The only inner frame I've actually been able to get fully off is the rear window frame. There are one or two screws I cannot get out from the side window frames, and I can't get more than a few screws out of each of the front cab-over window frames.

So not having to take the windows out would be really nice...

But it looks like I'll be doing this as a summer project. Wait till it's warm. For now, I'll worry about getting it back together and usable. There are endless things I could and will do to this thing...but I'm trying to focus my money and time on things that will get it usable, things that really should be done while it's all torn apart, and stuff like that. Outside window gaskets, if they can be done with the windows in place, can wait until it's all put back together and it's summer.

Thanks!

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:lol2:

Ok. I also think that the early Chinooks did some things "different", and my Newport model is a little more in line with a typical motorhome. I might be missing something, but those photos I saw of JDs don't look like my windows or gaskets. I think he might have something different going on.

If I can do it with the windows in place, I'll be doing it. I don't want to remove the windows...now would be the time, since the thing is still gutted right now, but the windows have actually been my biggest problem area.

All the screws are corroded, but especially the ones along the inside bottom of the window frames. The only inner frame I've actually been able to get fully off is the rear window frame. There are one or two screws I cannot get out from the side window frames, and I can't get more than a few screws out of each of the front cab-over window frames.

So not having to take the windows out would be really nice...

But it looks like I'll be doing this as a summer project. Wait till it's warm. For now, I'll worry about getting it back together and usable. There are endless things I could and will do to this thing...but I'm trying to focus my money and time on things that will get it usable, things that really should be done while it's all torn apart, and stuff like that. Outside window gaskets, if they can be done with the windows in place, can wait until it's all put back together and it's summer.

Thanks!

I can't speak for what worked with Linda since I have no idea how similar her windows are to mine; I don't know how similar mine are to your's either. I've got several Chinooks here, all from the late 70s. All have different shaped windows but all are similar in design. The glass is sealed via a glue-backed gasket between the glass and the inside frame. The rubber molding does on the outside. If - the glass was still adhered to the inside gasket so it would stay in place. and IF the outside molding was still pliable - I can see being able to carefully work it out. Then - with some new soft rubber molding and soap, working it in, carefully.

The molding that is in there now is pretty hard. No way would it just pull out without a big risk of breaking glass and no way is any soap going to soften it. A heat gun -maybe. I've seen many a windshield get broken by trying to remove hardened molding. That's why an expert will heat, and/or run a piano wire between the windshield and molding and cut it all the way around. NO way to do that in my Chinook.

I just had my sliding windows all the way out. I had to, in order to put in new wood panelling. The screw heads were almost rusted off with many. I had to use a hammer-impact wrench to get most out. A few I had to grind the heads off. They are all philips head. I wish they had been hex or square drive. Once the heads are off , or screws out, the inside trim pops off easily and then the window pushes out to the ouside. The stubs of the screws then come out easy with Vise-Grips.

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post-6578-0-41988100-1363307804_thumb.jp

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Yes, you're doing it right!

I got the interior frames off as much as I could, then just pulled the walls out. They'll go back in the same way. Would have been easier to do it with the windows out, and it would be nice having all freshly sealed windows...but it didn't happen for me. I'll get the panelling in hopefully more or less how it came out. Just work it in behind the frame, since I've got it pretty loose.

It's not going to be perfect, but it won't exactly be a joke, anyways, and it will look a lot better than it did when I bought it.

Well, I'll see about the windows.

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Yes, you're doing it right!

I got the interior frames off as much as I could, then just pulled the walls out. They'll go back in the same way.

I can't figure how you can do a decent job that way . . . but maybe your setup is different. The inside window ring has a flange that covers the cut-hole on the wood paneling. Also, the wood paneling has sections of 1" X 2" behind it in several places to space it off the fiberglass wall. I know on my rig, when the wood paneling was cut and assembled with the the 1" x 2"s in place, there's no way it could of been shoved in over an already installed window.

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Either ours are different, or our definition of decent is different.

The walls came out fine, I don't really see why they won't go back in ok.

My windows have an inside trim/retainer ring with a flange that is maybe 1/2" bigger then the hole in the wood panel behind it. In order to install new paneling without removing the ring, the hole in the paneling cut would have to be cut oversize so it would fit OVER the lip of the trim-ring instead of behind it. That would not only leave an ugly gap, it would also leave little to retain the wood paneling against the wall around the perimeter of the window. In my Chinook . . the window does most of the work holding the paneling to the wall.

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Yes mine are that way, too. But if, for example, I cut the panelling in a U shape to fit around the window, problem fixed. Depending on what type of panelling I use and how i lay it out, you wouldn't even be able to see the seam.

But I won't disagree that getting the frames out would be the best way to do it, and its best to not have seams. If the seam was on the top, the cabinets that run along the ceiling would cover the seam. If I put it along the bottom, the bench cushions, sink and stove cabinets would cover it.

Plus, since there are only a couple screws on the side windows that wouldn't come out, the frames are dangling there pretty loosely. I actually think I could get them around a one-piece panel.

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Yes mine are that way, too. But if, for example, I cut the panelling in a U shape to fit around the window, problem fixed. Depending on what type of panelling I use and how i lay it out, you wouldn't even be able to see the seam.

But I won't disagree that getting the frames out would be the best way to do it, and its best to not have seams. If the seam was on the top, the cabinets that run along the ceiling would cover the seam. If I put it along the bottom, the bench cushions, sink and stove cabinets would cover it.

Plus, since there are only a couple screws on the side windows that wouldn't come out, the frames are dangling there pretty loosely. I actually think I could get them around a one-piece panel.

It's your machine and I'm not trying to tell you what to do. It it was mine, I'd get those screws out. They can't get stuck too bad. It's steel sheet-metal screws into aluminum. The problem I had getting mine out was the lousy Philips heads that strip very easy. There is no way mine would of come out with a screwdriver. A hammer-driven impact wrench is a must. It puts down pressure on the Philips slot and keeps it from stripping as it shocks it loose. I had two that I DID strip. I ground off the screw heads with a small Dremel -type tool. In my case, an air-powered die grinder with a carbide bit. Once the inside trim ring is off, the remnants of the headless screws come out easy with Vise-Grips.

By the way, on my Chinook - after I got the window out, and panelling off, that square bar that runs under the window was heavily rusted. I wire-brushed it and then painted with Rustoleum "Rusty Metal Primer" and then paint. I would not wanted to have left it that way. It is a major support.

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Tools I don't have...but we'll see.

I don't disagree that your way is more the "right" way. Either way..my windows aren't coming out at this stage of the project. Going to be rainy season soon, still the possibility of snow, the Chinook won't fit in my garage, and I want to be using it by the time the weather will be nice enough to take the windows out.

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Tools I don't have...but we'll see.

I don't disagree that your way is more the "right" way. Either way..my windows aren't coming out at this stage of the project. Going to be rainy season soon, still the possibility of snow, the Chinook won't fit in my garage, and I want to be using it by the time the weather will be nice enough to take the windows out.

I'ts snowing right now an it's 18 degrees F outside, so I know how weather affects projects. My Chinook is inside my heated shop which is rare for my RVs. With an 8 foot ceiling, most won't fit inside.

Impact screwdriver kits are a cheap investment. I probably have over 20 of them. The reason why I has some many sets is, when the bits break . . buying an entire new set is cheaper then buying just the bits.

Less then $8 here:

http://www.harborfreight.com/impact-screwdriver-set-with-case-37530.html

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JD,

One of the best tool investments I ever made was to buy a Makita cordless impact driver. I got mine from a local pawn shop for about $50.00, used of course, with a case, two batteries and a charger. I use it for removing and driving almost everything that has threads and it has saved me many hours of "wrist time" and rarely strips philips heads with the enough pressure on the tool. I suppose you have one, though.

John

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Interesting...

That would probably get those last screws out of the side windows, and all the screws that won't come out of the cab-over windows, which are the ones that are really bothering me, since I can't get enough of them out to even loosen up the frame and get the pleather material and foam out from behind them.

Thanks.

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JD,

One of the best tool investments I ever made was to buy a Makita cordless impact driver. I got mine from a local pawn shop for about $50.00, used of course, with a case, two batteries and a charger. I use it for removing and driving almost everything that has threads and it has saved me many hours of "wrist time" and rarely strips Philips heads with the enough pressure on the tool. I suppose you have one, though.

John

Yes, I've got a Ryobi, and two Makita impact gun/drills. They work great for drilling holes in concrete. Also for turning screws. Battery screw guns have come a long way. I was an aluminum-siding installer when we used a hand-powered Yankee screwdriver for "fast" install of screws. Then (late 60s,early 70s maybe) Black and Decker came out with a 7.2 volt 1/4" drill and we thought it was absolutely amazing. No removable battery either. We had to have 3-4 guns to get through one day and it took 12 hours to recharge one. When Makita showed up later with their 7.2 volt gun and removable battery - well - then we thought no way could it ever get better. Hard to believe now. I still have a couple of 7.2 and 9.6 volt Makitas and the batteries are still good. With the Makitas that followed though, battery life was much shorter. It got to a point I didn't find Makita cost-effective anymore. I'm sold now on the Ryobi 18 volt tools. Batteries priced fairly cheap when on sale at Home Depot. The amount of stuff that runs of the 18 volt batteries is amazing. We take much in our RV. Three types of flashlights, radio, vacuum cleaner, air compressor, jig saw, reciprocating saw, impact gun, screw gun, circular saw, etc.

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JD,

How big of an inverter would I need to be able to charge a 14.5 volt Makita battery?

John

I've charged my Makita and Ryobi batteries with a 400 watt sine-wave inverter and had no problems. Also done it with a 750 watt mod-wave. Sometimes the brand and model of the inverter matters as much as the wattage rating though.

It's rare to see any battery-charger for any screw-gun to draw more then 100 watts. So in theory a 200 watt inverter should work but I've never messed with one that small. You can buy a 750 watt (1500 watt surge) for $50 and a 2000 watt (4000 watt surge) for $120.

Most inverters will run a battery charger slower then when plugged into the grid. If it takes 30 minutes of the grid, it might take 45 minutes to a full hour from an inverter. No problem, just a little slower. 12 volt chargers for the screw guns work real nice for off grid if you're in a hurry for your charges. I've got one for my Ryobi 18 volt batteries.

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  • 7 months later...

In case it matters to anyone, this is what I ended up doing. When I took the photos was the first time I've really looked closely at my work since it all dried...looks like a few of the spots could have used a thicker bead...but we'll see. For now, the weather is too cold for doing anything more. It's definitely better than it was.

There were about 4 areas on each window I did this to.

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I just cut out what had pulled away from the window edge, and filled in the gaps with caulk.

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I don't remember you asking for that stuff. That window glazing molding is readily available in many different sizes. Not difficult to replace. Scroll down to glaze bead

http://www.interstatemetals.com/cat_windows2.htm

Linda S

You have to search them out on this page cause they are not listed together but they have measurements so you can figure out what one would fit yours.

http://www.pellandent.com/RV_Products_List.aspx?CategoryID=71

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