Bob the Builder's Build

[Bob the Builder]

Thanks much WME. I agree with him entirely about the 8020. I spent last year building my brother's 7x16 cargo van into a toy hauler. the rear eight foot for the two Harley's, (drop down king size bed on 4-12 volt actuators gives him 28" sleeping over the Harleys and the front 8 foot includes front cabinets with sink, 4.3 frig, 30 x 36 wet bath, black water and grey water tanks, 7 gal hot water heater and 28 gal fresh. I looked a lot at builds before starting, and I ruled out the 8020 because of the restrictions it imposes. While not close to being the same kind of build as his toy hauler, my gooseneck Sunrader will definitely need the lightweight approach like the guy in the video takes. Consider the weight of everything used in it. Borrowed the wife's parking spot this weekend and rolled the trailer in to change the axles. 2000# torsion out, and 3500# drop leaf spring in. I know that I'm lowering the floor of the Sunrader shell by 5" but I'm also raising the height of the trailer from where it sat on the torsion axle. I also need to maintain a certain amount of clearance height for the black and grey water tanks, as I want them below floor level. It took some additional effort, but as you can see in the pics, I went ahead and cut the side ribs so I could raise my axle reinforcement up to floor level, (that also dropped the trailer floor that 2 inches). Putting the 1/8" 2x2 tube on the outside of the main rail puts it exactly at the same width as the leaf spring perches and makes the undercarriage very stout. Talked to my steel guy today and he assures me that for the gooseneck runners, dual 1 1/2 x 3 tubes of 1/8" wall will be fine so I ordered those. I know some of the pics I put on here are not a Sunrader, but in the end they will all mesh with the finished product and are part of the whole build. I did get to a new Harbour Freight that just opened 9 miles from me and got my zip suit for the upcoming fiberglass trim job (thanks ToyoGuy).

Edited April 25, 2023 by Bob the Builder
spelling

[WME]

I dunno know, I love my Torsion axles. I have left stuff loose on the floor, driven across Wyoming and it was still where I left it. I do understand your moves based on carry captivity and $$$, but I just saying.

 

[Bob the Builder]

I struggled with that one myself, WME. I have a torsion under my first attempt at a unique camper and love it. Very comfortable tow and easy on the equipment. I'll post some pics. I went with the axle I had because of the unknowns I might end up encountering with the gooseneck design. I can always shell out the bucks and convert if I absolutely hate it.

[WME]

Looks cool, like a Hi-Lo

Edited April 26, 2023 by WME

[Bob the Builder]

Short update post on the build. ToyoGuy, I tried out a variation of sanding the edges of the remaining fiberglass from when I cut the floor out. I bought a $19 oscillating tool (HF), and shaved that extra ridge off in about 40 min. (Half round blade worked the best). I still have to clean up the corners a little, but it sure did the job! Almost zero dust although I did wear the respirator and gloves. Still trying to decide how far to drop the floor. Originally I was going level to the bottom of the door, but it won't be entirely smooth because of the transom anyway. It's 7 inches if I go below the floor level at the door, a bit too much for me, but if I only go 5 or 6 inches, I have to do something goofy to be able to get to the inside door trim screws. Suggestions? Trying to keep the overall height down as low as possible but my trailer floor will end up around 18 - 20 inches from the ground at the least. How tall is the roof off of the ground on a stock Sunrader? I measured mine before I started, but didn't write that down. The bottom of my overhead, (over the cab part), looks like it will be about 5'2" or so. Just curious.

[ToyoGuy]

Hey there BTB,

Looks about like mine did, but you don't have a frame to trip over, I'm jealous.

Soooo...  on the other stuff. Yeah, I use(d) the same oscillating tool for some plunge-cuts, but I have some old carpal tunnel issues from using cast-cutters all day for years, that it aggravates, so I am limited that way. Also, I seem to go through the blades pretty fast on fiberglass cuts. Really nice to hear about the lack of dust though. I got to hate that stuff, I did so much glassing for my build.

I knew I'd be coving the perimeter above and below the floor and road barrier, so it was nice for me to use the angle grinder to take care of the cutting-back of the old rotten stuff and do the 4"  scuff-prep above and below the floor margins for good adhesion prep on the 23 yr old fiberglass.

 

On floor height at the bottom of the door thought, ....the entry step-down in the stock setup (I had to rebuild mine entirely) actually has a drain hole most people don't know about for when it's raining sideways and you're getting in and out of the coach. Kinda nice to have one place on the floor to put really wet shoes/stuff that'll drain.

 

Other thoughts on where the floor goes... like things you mentioned.... road clearance (sounds like you know what you want) , thickness of the floor top to bottom, ceiling thickness (insulation and any reinforcements at the ceiling) (don't forget to figure for light fixtures). I'm a shorter guy, and I think I ended up at 5' 10" of total ceiling height, but that would be unacceptable for lots of folks. Of course, good to consider overall height of the rig (any plans for racks on top?), In my opinion, the stock 'Rader is plenty exciting in a "robust" cross-wind. You're doing a trailer, and you gotta figure your tolerance for that and how much your "provisioned" weight/height will be. I have been known to fill the regular gas tank, fill an extra 5 gal Jerry can and top off the fresh water tank to get up CA 395 through Bishop in a stiff blow before

 

Since you're almost starting with a kind of blank slate, I'd think a lot. (it's cheap), measure twice and ..... well, you know.

There's a lot unsaid/unread about the plans for closing off the cab pass-through. (I'd better read through prior posts, I'm showing my age here)

 

My rig is 9' 6" from the ground to the tops of the coach vents when they're closed, but... it's a 4x4 w/a 1" lift kit and stock 2wd are lower, I'm sure. (Maybe Linda can help?)  "Inside door trim screws" you mean the aluminum trim that pulls the door frame into the port? IMHO gotta be able to get to those to tighten occasionally.

Well heck, that's a lot said for not much said.

It's looking great so far,

BR,

TG

[Bob the Builder]

Thanks ToyoGuy. Here's where I'm at. Measured shell sitting on stilts waiting for trailer and it's 106" outside top of the exterior roof, (no AC or vents). Will come down approx 9-10" when sitting on settled trailer frame without interior. I'm gluing 1/4" duraplate (superior tensile strength, waterproof and easily fiberglassed) down on the trailer frame first and fiberglass it to the wall. Then glue a layer of the pink closed cell styro board down and then glue a layer of the Birch 3/8" plwood, fiberglass it to the walls and a coat over the floor (hope I get it as smooth as yours). For the door well step and height, I'm going to put the floor level with the edge of the entry door with a 2" deep step down across the opening inside the door so that I can get at those screws and a drain hole. I'm going to make a waterproof block to lay inside that carve out so that stepping inside to the floor will be level with the door. that will have me lowerering the floor about 5" which will give me 76" clear height inside to the bare roof. I'm trying to get to an 84" total exterior height because my garage door is right there. If I can get reasonably close, I can always have a set of smaller wheels & tires to use when putting in the garage for maintenance, etc. I appreciate everyone's feedback as there is a lot to consider with so many parameters, etc. It helps trigger a lot of thought, and I don't want to miss the most of it,(there is always something afterwards). I think this should be extremely strong with the double connection at the wall and I can move on up from the floor.

[ToyoGuy]

Heya Bob,

So, 76" from top of floor to the bare shell/ceiling , then, minus at least 5/8" for insulation and paneling for the ceiling (more, if you're going to put in braces across the top), minus 1 1/2"-2" for light fixtures, (unless they're side-mounted under cabs). So it sounds like you're ending up at 73" +/- in height (I did re-read and seem to recall, you're a bit over 6'), so it sounds do-able.

 

No vents on top?.....well hmmm, I gotta figure you have an excellent alternate cross-ventilation plan. ; )

 

The clearance block to fill the step-well is a very good plan. The aluminum "blade" that surrounds the entry-door port and provides a surface for the door to seal against, is commonly bent in at the bottom threshold in most SunRaders I've seen, from people bearing their entire weight on it, instead of stepping in onto the floor or in the stepwell.    I spent an afternoon straightening mine and still have to warn people not to step directly on the door frame.

 

"smaller wheels & tires", now why the heck didn't I think of that?

 

I agree on strength of the floor as suggested.

 

I measured my coach and found to my surprise, that I have about 1" more height at the rear dinette. My recollection is that I stayed with the stock floor margin and just raised it equally around the whole perimeter to allow for my slightly thicker floor. Not sure why I'm including that here...

 

Random thought. Maybe burn one afternoon, and rig the whole frame/floor height/ ground clearance-wheel-tire size/ ceiling height/hitch height thing up temporarily with blocks (looks like you got a few)  and back up the tow vehicle for hitch geometry (I mean, what the heck, my neighbors already thought I was crazy when I did mock-ups)  After setting it all in place, you may find that, with your planned design(s), that the slant or reveal of the top or bottom of your coach looks kind of "wonky". That kind of result drives me crazy after all those work hours, welding wire and resin.

 

Also something to think on as you go on.... Under the ("there is always something afterwards") subject, I upgraded all my wire gauge and wish I has installed some PVC or similar tubing from front to back, for a raceway to keep the wire bundle clean and also throw an extra circuit or two for the future projects. The downside is, that you can't just splice into the bundle half-way because it's contained in the tube. Could leave a couple of 10" gaps, I guess.

 

 I'll be interested in what you're doing with the sides for strength. The proof that my rig suffered from severe "oil-canning" (walls puckering or distorting in the wind) was that all of the stock 4' x 2" x  5/8" lateral plywood stringers originally glassed to the walls for reinforcement were laying loose in the walls when I did my tear-out.

 

Well, that's all my brain is good for, for now,

Your planning and quality of work is really impressive and inspiring. Especially at our age.

BTW, when young people who have bought a project SunRader talk to me during a build and ask about seemingly impossible show-stoppers, (after encouraging them as much as possible), I tell them a side-benefit is that, by the time they are done, they will be able to perform at least one major engineering / fabricating miracle per week!

 

BR,

TG

[Bob the Builder]

ToyoGuy, I really appreciate your interest in my project. You have excellent ideas. Gets the thoughts going. Inside window AC over fridge, (checked out many posts about that so that I would know where I was headed with that). I will have power roof vents, front and rear, so there goes some height. I'm 6' even or was, (my kids keep telling me that I'm shrinking due to age), so that might give me a little. I plan on glassing in aluminum roof bows, (that darned semi trailer background), some are a hat type section and they already have a bow in them 1" tall, and I can save a bit on them by getting the old stock for 96' wide trailers, they aren't in demand any more. Led light strips will keep the lighting at a whisper of height. I was planning on doing your excellent idea of mocking up everything for road height,etc. Part of the reason for the adjustable column stands for the shell, (good for leveling also). The main tow vehicle, (the Diamond T), will more than likely have air ride at the rear and my gooseneck hitch height is adjustable up and down so I will have a little "fudge" in there. Some of the older semi trailers had 1" I sections for roof bows. I'm thinking about glassing them in for some wall uprights and something to screw to although I'm pretty sure my stringers are still there. Haven't been thinking a lot about the inside dynamics right now, I'm mocking up the gooseneck end on the trailer out of 2x4's for correct angles and lengths to cut the steel. You would think that drawing everything out on graph paper several times would be enough, but the truth is I don't trust Bob's thought process entirely anymore. (Don't tell Bob)! Again, input is golden. It's too easy to miss something. Keep the comments coming! Sorry for the ramblin' on.

[WME]

Ribs...

Foam backer rods contact glued to the roof and then fiber glassed over make strong light ribs. Comes in sizes from 1/4" to 1". The rod is just the form, the fiberglass shape is the strength.

I've also rolled up brown Kraft paper around dowels and broom handles to make the shape for the fiberglass. Depends on your budget at the time.

 

[Bob the Builder]

Good idea, WME. I can put that process together with ToyoGuy's conduit idea and use a hollow tube through from the wall to the center, glass the rib in leaving the tube holes open and have a way to wire in any center interior lights. Excellent! Thanks.

[Bob the Builder]

OK, finally Stage 2 is basically done. The little camper trailer is basically now a gooseneck with adjustable hitch that will fit on my 1936 Ford Sedan, and more importantly fit what should end up being my main tow vehicle, the 1938 Diamond T pick up truck. (This tow vehicle will be a while coming, the main focus now is the gooseneck Sunrader). The trailer frame ended up with a dry weight of 480lbs so far but there are a few more braces, and under camper overhang storage rack to add to the weight tally plus the final choice on tire and wheel combo. Tongue weight at present is 90lbs but that is highly adjustable with storage and final weight of additional Sunrader configuration. I finished painting under the trailer this morning, took it to the local quarry to weigh and just couldn't resist slipping it under the shell to see if my computations were going to be anywhere close to joining the two. The little wheel and tire combo worked great (2" axle to ground clearance), to allow the frame to slip under the shell. I can't slide it all the way back, because my rear cribbing is going to be in the way so I will have to make two more short adjustable columns under the outside of my rear cross brace and remove the cribbing. Minor setback, but happy with the results so far.

[Bob the Builder]

So I built two new short columns for the rear and took out all the bulky cribbing. It took an entire day to roll the trailer under the shell and lift it into place going a few inches at a time to clear the rolled bottom edges of the shell on the sides. The trailer has to go in toward the back of the shell at a nose heavy angle to clear the fiberglass flaps in the wheel wells. The little tires helped to roll it past and then I could start to level out the trailer and go further toward the rear. Block, lift, nudge, lift the back, lift the front, pull the shell wall out, scoot it to the right, then left, then repeat everything over and over. I finally have the trailer in position, centered inside the shell, level in every direction and blocked under the tires in a loaded stance. I then went around several times adjusting each of my supporting columns on the shell until it was equal distance to the top of the trailer frame 4 1/2" below the original floor line. (This should also put the floor surface right at the trim height of the door bottom). I took my sawsall and cut out the outer frame rail for the door notch that will be in the floor to get at the trim screws. So the trailer is solidly sitting there in the middle of the shell and I can rock the walls on the sides so nothing is binding. I will put a 1" angle flat side up across the rear, and that gives me a real close fit front to back. I went down each side and marked where I could put either a 1" or 2" strip of angle on each side. That should get my sides relatively close enough to give the floor good support. I will position and drill these strips but I cannot put them on until I have the trailer back under here for the last time. Now all I have to do is get this trailer back out from under here and into the garage again for the final mods. This makes me wonder why I traded in my little 120v Hobart welder for the 220v I have now. I could have carried that little one all the way out here and plugged it in to an extension cord. Oh well, better job in the garage anyway. I know, sorry for another rambling post. Just trying to keep somewhat up to date.

[linda s]

All I can say is wow. This thing is going to be Barrett-Jackson worthy. I'm thinking you must be about 35 but feel like you have an old soul. 

Linda S 

[Bob the Builder]

OK, it's been a couple weeks or so. Life, (wife's garden, painting the house, landscaping, etc) has slowed the build for a bit but back to it now. Gooseneck trailer and edge wings are done and it's time to get serious about mating these two together for the final time. I'm sure you guys already know this, but there is absolutely nothing about this Sunrader body that is even remotely level, equidistant, or symmetric from side to side, corner to corner or front to back! It's kinda like trying to center an egg around a perfectly formed rectangular platform without two matching places to measure from. Finally had to turn off a bit of OCD that I didn't know I had and rely on common sense generalizing. Leveled the trailer frame, (the easy part), at a starting height close to the approximate floor height on the shell that I'm after. Centered the rear of the trailer frame on the hole in the back (which by eyeball measuring with a tape on the outside is pretty much center of the shell at that level), then measured side to center on the front pass-thru opening at floor level. On my shell, the opening for the pass-thru appears to be centered in the overall width across the front of the shell, (again with eyeballing the tape measure). I had to adjust the height of the shell in the front a smidgen to get the window cutouts to read level across the bottom front to back.  As ToyoGuy had suggested, I had already mocked up approximate ride level, orientation of the shell, and after many conversations with "Bob" decided that I had arrived at the profile I wanted to present. The trailer is level, the shell reads level across the back bottom transom fold in the middle, the front pass-thru reads level across the top of the overhead opening and the center of the gooseneck reads level and is centered in the pass-thru opening. This will give me 77" at the rear, tapering toward the front to 76" (before the floor thickness),and will position the final top of the floor surface approx 1/4" above the door transom. The walls at this point are free floating with no obstruction on the sides since they are suspended on the columns. When I position the interior wheel well caps level according to where the original floor was glassed, the width from centerline of the trailer to either side wall is within 1/4" both in front of and behind the wheel wells. So I'm saying I am satisfied this is as good as it's gonna get. Now for the oddball stuff. The axle is off on one side by 1/2" from being centered in the wheel well when comparing side to side. It is also off about 1/2" in and out when compared side to side. The equidistant line that I marked around the interior perimeter by measuring straight down from the original floor glass line is tapered down from the front of the wheel well to the front corner (both sides), by close to 1/2". I know that fiberglass things out of a mold are not entirely exact and nobody can look down both sides at the same time, so I'm going to go with where it's at. However, if any of you technical people spot something wrong with my process, please let me know! I'm ready to order my fiberglass supplies and start the point of no return. Thanks for putting up with the rambling again and I appreciate any input.

[ToyoGuy]

On 6/9/2023 at 9:28 PM, Bob the Builder said:

Now for the oddball stuff. The axle is off on one side by 1/2" from being centered in the wheel well when comparing side to side. It is also off about 1/2" in and out when compared side to side. The equidistant line that I marked around the interior perimeter by measuring straight down from the original floor glass line is tapered down from the front of the wheel well to the front corner (both sides), by close to 1/2". I know that fiberglass things out of a mold are not entirely exact and nobody can look down both sides at the same time, so I'm going to go with where it's at. However, if any of you technical people spot something wrong with my process, please let me know! I'm ready to order my fiberglass supplies and start the point of no return.

By God Bob, you're a credit to the forces of mechanical obsession...  Of course, without being there, ....one can only speculate on your/Bob's final out come, but I will say personally, that I got to the same place on my build, and like you said, had to work with what came out of the mold and just get on with it. Sounds like you've done everything possible to insure success.  On the above however, If you've got a set of the rivet-on original fender flares with your donor, (thought I saw one in an earlier picture)  you should be able to cheat one side either forward or back to get the wheel centered front-to-back on whatever "offending" side might need it. The inset of either tire/wheel of only 1/2" will only bother you and no one else will likely notice. The most careful vehicle restoration I ever did was a '71 Dodge Powerwagon and  I searched endlessly for a replacement driver's side door without the later model inset around the door handle. Finally gave up, mounted the later one, prepped and painted. In all the years I had that truck, no one ever said a word about the doors not matching because they never saw them both at once.

Looking really good.

BR,

TG

[Bob the Builder]

Yeah, TG. I finally figured it's like that old adage, "Nobody will notice it on a galloping goose, they will be busy watching the goose gallop!" Another what if? If I glue in a length of 3/4 PVC tubing across the top of the first layer of floor in the seam between my styrofoam insulation, will it weaken the floor structure? I'm thinking I could run my 110V through it for AC which will be overhead the refrigerator above the pass side wheel well. Possibly another at the next seam of styrofoam for ? I plan to stagger all the seams of each layer so that none will match out of the total floor construction anyway. Pros, cons? More minds make a better finished product!

[ToyoGuy]

Hey BTB,

Been outta town...

Looking at the sub-frame in your pictures and following as best I can, your plan for A/C conduit "sammiched" in the floor....

On 5/1/2023 at 11:19 AM, Bob the Builder said:

gluing 1/4" duraplate (superior tensile strength, waterproof and easily fiberglassed) down on the trailer frame first and fiberglass it to the wall. Then glue a layer of the pink closed cell styro board down and then glue a layer of the Birch 3/8" plwood, fiberglass it to the walls

as long as your PVC isn't under, or too close to, the birch ply seam, it all sounds / looks good. There's a lot of steel under that floor (good thing it's a pull-behind, behind a good truck!) I'd just make sure you have good adhesive and prepping.

 

BR,

TG

[Bob the Builder]

Weighed just the trailer frame TG. 500lbs the way it sits before going under the shell. I know there is no way to start making comparisons, just curious what it will weigh with Sunrader shell added. Plan on weighing the bare combo before I start remodel. Went through pics and info you posted on your floor and have a couple questions and, yes, all seams from anything in the floor will be staggered. Did you put a layer of epoxy resin on your plywood before glassing them to the wall and did you put anything on the underside (again, of the plywood) before putting them down? Finishing up my patterns and getting to the critical part of prep before putting the floor in.. Going to use West products for the fiberglass stuff. Assuming you used both mat and woven cloth. Did you use any filler to make the radius right at the wall or were your floor pieces close enough without filler? How many layers of fiberglass did you put down at the joint? I will have the advantage of my subfloor already being glassed against the shell and waterproof already.  My wall/floor joint will be really close, so I'm thinking that using a 3/8" roller will create a strong enough joint at the wall. As long as I follow correct procedures with the resin, etc., I'm thinking my (double joint will be super strong. I'm going to use 5/16" stainless countersunk elevator bolts going through from the top of the plywood to the frame below. I struggled with how many to put, and discussed it at length with "Bob". Again, probably over engineering, but "Bob" and I both think that we will not be the ones who will ever be taking this thing apart in the future sooooo, I've spotted about 12 to 16 positions for flooring bolts at key points to secure the duraplate seams and then to secure the plywood. All duraplate seams will be matched up on cross members and sealed so there should not be any possible water intrusion. I'm sure this will all take a good bit of time, especially at my speed, but again, I only want to do this once. If it finishes up looking anything close to yours, I will be a happy, shall we say camper! Thoughts and comments by any and all appreciated.

[ToyoGuy]

Het BTB,

I tried to address these in order:

On 6/16/2023 at 6:12 PM, Bob the Builder said:

Did you put a layer of epoxy resin on your plywood before glassing them to the wall

 I used polyester resin in my build all the way through, just personal experience and knowing the product. I did do a thinner saturating "wash-coat" of both the scuff-

sanded wall of the interior of the coach and about 8" in on the top of the raw marine grade ply I used, to insure adhesion of the main layup of the coving. 

On 6/16/2023 at 6:12 PM, Bob the Builder said:

did you put anything on the underside (again, of the plywood) before putting them down?

The FRP bottom / road facing of my rig is also fiberglass-coved and water proofed around the entire perimeter, so I just primed and painted the underside of my flooring with a good paint and called it good. 6 or more years now, not a sign of any moisture.

On 6/16/2023 at 6:12 PM, Bob the Builder said:

Assuming you used both mat and woven cloth.

 

I used alternating oriented strand (read surfboard-type cloth, for the uninitiated) and random strand (stranding each which-way, no order). At previous points of obvious original stress failure, I used a heavier oriented strand cloth as well on top.  You can see the heavier cloth on top in the third of my pictures of my floor in this thread.

On 6/16/2023 at 6:12 PM, Bob the Builder said:

Did you use any filler to make the radius right at the wall or were your floor pieces close enough without filler?

Yeah, I got foam material from a friend in the fiberglass business to shape into triangular-shaped strips to get a nice sturdy, even and round cove behind the cloth.

On 6/16/2023 at 6:12 PM, Bob the Builder said:

How many layers of fiberglass did you put down at the joint?

Five layers at the wall, as I recall....  and a single oriented strand over the lateral floor seams, (because they are so well mounted). Again, not a hair's width of movement of any of it in 6 yrs.

On 6/16/2023 at 6:12 PM, Bob the Builder said:

I've spotted about 12 to 16 positions for flooring bolts at key points to secure the duraplate seams and then to secure the plywood.

Sounds good, fasteners are cheap, it'd be a drag to address this later. Mine is secured at 12 points besides the preimeter 'glass. No rattles, no flexing, no distortion, no stress-popping. Life is good.

On 6/16/2023 at 6:12 PM, Bob the Builder said:

I only want to do this once.

My thoughts exactly. Others may think this stuff is overkill, but I don't regret a single minute of planning. There's enough to do in/on RV's without "re-do's".

Thanks for the compliment. Credit where it's due...... I've learned so much from the people who run this site and others who shared.

Enjoy the process.

BR,

TG

[Bob the Builder]

OK, it's been a while so I'll catch up a little. Been working on the project almost some of every day but it sure seems like it's taking forever to get somewhere. I centered and leveled the frame in the shell (for the twentieth time) and wedged everything so nothing could change position. I made patterns for and cut the first layer of flooring, (the aluminum sandwich panel). Then modified the patterns and cut the styrofoam. Then once more modified the patterns and cut the plywood. There are no seams matching on the floor, and the aluminum panel seams all are in the center of a crossmember running side to side. I glued down the aluminum panels to the frame using adhesive/sealant and took care to double bead the seam crossmembers and a bead between the panels as I seated each against the adjoining panel. As I had already marked and drilled holes in the frame previously, I placed a lot of stabilizing weight placed on the panels and drilled holes for my through bolts. I made sure that I had bolts going exactly in the middle of where the seams would be so that I could draw down the seams in unison. With the aluminum laminates glued down I put the syrofoam and plywood down into position and weighted them down in position. Then I drilled up through for matching holes in all layers of the flooring. Removed everything but the aluminum laminate layer, put bolts through to hold into position, and started glassing to the walls. I don't think there is much need for describing the fiberglassing much, it's pretty straight forward. Since this was basically the sealing level of fiberglass on my floor I layed it all up using a 2" brush and a 3" x 3/8" roller where possible. I think when I do the plywood glassing, I will use a roller pan and soak the mat & cloth before placing it against the wall. I was worried about getting all the air out so that I was sure I had a good seal against the rough wall so I dabbed a lot with the brush. The second level will be much easier I think.

[linda s]

You've done an incredible job. Please even after the trailer is done stay with us and post pics so we can see it behind your restored truck.

I think you did mention you intended to pull this with your Diamond truck. It's going to be epic.

Linda S

[Bob the Builder]

Thanks Linda. It's a long way to go yet but the information I find on here is very much appreciated and invaluable. A lot of very talented people willing to share. Yes, I will be pulling it behind the 1938 Diamond T pickup (To be finished after this project is done), but I built it so that I can also pull it behind my 1936 Ford, (picture attached). We hope to have it far enough along to take it out next summer some. The interior will not be close to done, but we hope it's usable enough to camp.

[Bob the Builder]

Been busy with fiberglassing for a while now but thought I would kinda catch up on the project a bit. 3rd layer of floor is down and just about all fiberglassed in, (waiting on more resin and hardener). I ended up using 16 bolts through the flooring to the frame. I believe I will be glad that I did run some electrical across the floor between the layers, 2ea 14-2 for 120 volt and 4ea for 12 volt circuits. Everything ended up being pretty tight and snug. I had narrowed the wheel wells and glassed them to the 1st layer of flooring so the styrofoam and 3rd layer are then cut out around the wheel wells and fiberglassed in. I will probably pull the wheels off when the floor is all finished and fiberglass on the outside of the wheel well surgery just to reinforce and clean up the looks underneath. After all of this fiberglassing, I hate to say it but the next item will be filling in the open holes in the shell that will not be needed. I plan on using polyester resin for those so that I have better choices as far as fairing them instead of the epoxy I used on the floor. It's hard to look at all that floor space and resist starting on something inside. Ended up with a full 74" to 75" of headroom so far.

[WME]

Starting to look like a mobile dance hall

[IdahoDoug]

Are you going to paint the top surface of the plywood floor before putting your flooring choice down?  I was kind of surprised the SunRader folks didn't put something on it from the factory to resist water.  Just a simple quality paint would have prevented a lot of grief for today's owners by helping the wood resist water absorption from interior spills over the decades...

[Bob the Builder]

ID, plan is to put roll linoleum on the floor and curl up the wall a bit. I will have to pull center bolts back out and countersink a little, and I have two spots about 6" on a couple seams that stand up about 1/16" to 1/8" before I put it down smooth. I used my John Deere weights to hold the each panel of plywood down for install, but I only had five of them. I think when I pulled the bolts down the seam puckered a hair in those spots, otherwise the seams laid down real smooth. I can push on the seam and make it match perfectly at those spots, so when the resin and hardener gets here I'm going to make a weighted bridge across those places and run some epoxy down along the seam. I hadn't considered painting the whole floor before the linoleum. Now I'm wondering how does the floor glue work on paint and how long would the paint have to cure before I can put it down? It makes sense to have a double barrier to protect the top of the plywood, after all there is now a double barrier on the bottom.

[linda s]

Since the sheet vinyl is waterproof I wouldn't try the paint the floor first. The adhesive will bond to the wood but if you paint first, the adhesive bond will only be as strong as the paint bond and we all know paint can peel. As far as I know all Sunraders had carpet and that was the water damage issue. Under carpet sealing the floor would have been a good idea. 

Linda S

[Bob the Builder]

Excellent, Linda! That's the type of info I was looking for. Thanks.

[nicklee]

🤩Very impressive

[Bob the Builder]

Thanks, nicklee, just step 2 out of many. Finally the epoxy and hardener arrived, and I was able to finish glassing around the rest of the wall.  I still have to fill and finesse the cut out for the door frame on the bottom at the entrance but pretty satisfied with the rest. I weighted the floor in the raised spots and poured some epoxy across the seams and that did the trick. Smooth floor side to side and front to back. I've been wondering for quite a while just how much this combination would weigh at this point, so today we took it to our local quarry and weighed it. It towed straight as an arrow and the walls were very stable, I thought, for not having any support structure yet. Total weight is 1380 lbs so far. I am thrilled! I was hoping that at this point I would be around 1500 lbs or less. My next question naturally, was how much does the shell weigh. I knew the trailer weight before the flooring because I had weighed it, 550 lbs. So I figured the weight of the flooring material for 78 sq/ft of flooring (avg width of 78" x 144" length): composite aluminum 122 lbs, 3/8 plywood 70 lbs, 2 gals of epoxy 18 lbs and nuts and bolts at 5 lbs for a total floor weight of 215 lbs. So trailer frame with floor in at 765 lbs. That makes the weight of the shell bare in it's present state to be right at 615 lbs. Now, I know the side windows weren't in, so I just checked to see what they weigh so I guess we can add another 10 lbs or so for a completely stripped out shell for the weight of 625 lbs. I was thinking around 700 to 750. I intend to keep pretty accurate account of what weight I add from here on out, but I think I will be able to keep the total weight very manageable for either tow vehicle, the '36' Ford or the '38' Diamond T pickup. Now I need to decide what will be step 3 and get going.

[Bob the Builder]

Starting on all the exterior fiberglass work for step 3. Removed the rear crank up vent from the roof and took off the temporary wood cover where the ac used to be mounted. This is my first close look at the condition of the roof, and I'm pleasantly surprised. There has obviously been a few leaks from time to time but I don't see anything extremely severe. The rear vent hole has some de-laminating of the luan from the waffle fill of the roof cross section toward the edge of the roof, and there is some de-laminating of the first layer of luan in the area of the ac opening. I have checked the rest of the roof for soft spots, staining, etc., and it feels rock solid. I cannot push any of the roof up anywhere. I put a 20 x 20 square of 5/8 plywood against the roof under the ac opening and with a pry bar between a 2x4 and the floor, I can't raise the middle of the roof more than 3/8 to 1/2 inch with quite a bit of force, (and this is a bare shell). So I think I'm good to go structure wise. I also removed the bathroom vent and will be filling that hole and relocating it to the lower step of the roof on that side. My plan is to not have any thing taller than the raised center section of roof line. I cut approximately 1 1/2 inches of the suspect side of the roof vent opening  to good core and then fitted and glued 1/2" pink styrofoam board there, a round piece in the vent hole, and a 14 x 14 piece in the ac opening. the 1/2" thickness fits perfectly between the gelcoat and fiberglass on the top side and the luan on the bottom, leaving the thickness of each showing. I will be prepping & fiberglassing the exterior to at least match the top level of the gelcoat and also the interior of the openings. I am debating with "Bob", whether I need any roof "bows" or support of some kind since the roof is very tight. Insert opinions here please! I will try to remember to get some pics of the openings with the styro in them before I fiberglass tomorrow.

[WME]

Remember that the newer Sunraders came with FACTORY beams to support the roof, just saying.

[Bob the Builder]

WME, thanks for the input. Since I have now a little extra headroom, I was considering this approach: 2" strips of plywood on 24" centers, glued across the ceiling with the 3M marine glue/sealant and braced up from the floor. Then when solid, and leaving the braces, fiberglassing around the strips to give them the permanent arch and the additional strength of the fiberglass on the sides. Then in between, I can glue my 1/2" styrofoam and then have a strips to fasten my finishing ceiling panels. I can put small tubing for wiring across to the center for lighting where needed. I don't think that the width of the plywood strips matters as much as having the fiberglass on the sides. What do you think?

[Bob the Builder]

Just a quick post to anyone following the build.  I have used and plan upon using quite a bit more of the pink styrofoam board in my build for various applications. I am also using both epoxy resin and polyester resin depending upon strength needed. A word of caution! YOU CANNOT USE POLYESTER RESIN WITH THE STYROFOAM BOARD: IT EATS IT ALIVE! The epoxy resin is perfectly fine with it. I had no idea until I started fiberglassing in my repair hole plugs. Luckily I started with the vent hole repair and it immediately started melting! I will be using the epoxy resin instead to finish these repairs, obviously.