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Stock Horizontal Propane Tank Filling Problem


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Had a new problem form on the rv this past trip to KY. Wife and I were pre-cooling the refer the day before we left on propane; and it stopped and started flashing red. I checked pilot and it wouldn't light, I checked stove burner and it wouldn't light or emit gas from any of the burners. The main gas valve was on for sure.

I took it to the gas place and the guy tried to fill the tank and could not; "This is absolutely full" he stated.

even the guage which sometimes works and sometimes not agreed with him.

I remember filling the tank in case I used the RV for hunting last year but used my cabin instead so in my mind yes it should indeed be full.

Something about his attempt to fill the tank must have loosened the problem because when I got home the gas worked again.

burners worked, fridge etc.

I went to KY and on day 3 of the trip while at a jelly stone the gas stopped working again, no burners etc.

I took it over to their fill station and their guy also tried to fill it and it would not take any gas. yes we made sure to hit the fill reset button, tried bleeder etc. it was full.

he didn't charge me and I went back to the campsite. upon getting there the gas mysteriously worked and stayed working the rest of the trip; I cooked several meals and ran the fridge so cold it made ice cubes.

So my question is naturally Why? is my regulator going bad? insect in tube? any idears fellers?

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I researched this bit, and found nothing of value in our site, but on other sites I found LP detector switches and fuses on other RVs... Do Toyotas have these?

My regulator after the tank has a plastic tamper proof cover blocking my access to it so I cannot tell if there is some kind of electronic solenoid controlling gas flow. I have also read that the furnace may cut it out.

Does anyone here know of this stuff>? anyone heard of this? I am camping tomorrow and want to be able to cook mac n cheese for my daughters and as you all know I don't use a microwave...

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There is a valve in the tank fitting that will shut off the gas if the pressure drops it does seem strange that, that would give you a problem with the tank fitting screwed all the way in. You are not dealing with a lot of line pressure so it kind of seems like a regulator issue to me it is about the only thing that might come and go. Electronic stuff did not show up until long after Toyota quit selling trucks to MH people.

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I had guys reporting on electronic LP detectors in 1987 model years on another site as the cause... My camper is a 1986... are you positive?

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I had guys reporting on electronic LP detectors in 1987 model years on another site as the cause... My camper is a 1986... are you positive?

I have no electronic detector on my 86 Sunrader and I've never seen one on the many newer Toyota motorhomes I've looked at.

Linda S

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Thanks for the confirmation Linda. that means the only other place it could be is the regulator. I am unscrewing the master regulator and its flange valve is failing to open or sticking.

I would think replacing the regulator would fix it... but what to do about the full tank!?

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I unscrewed the regulator, and for fun opened the tank valve... Nothing came out, but it had a brass nipple, at this point im thinking the tank valve is stuck. So.. Its stuck full at 89% gas! Who could fix this my local rv shop?

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your tank could be empty those tank fill button setups go bad have seen 2 tanks on motor homes with that system both bad . you can not fill it when they go bad it will not take propane. the fix is buy the replacement kit which is a manual type bleed screw and a replacement filler neck. I have installed this on a friends mother home . you remove the button setup and the filler neck, the local rv place sold the parts but no one would install it . I did it . then he filled it up and worked fine. seems they fail shut can't fill it up.

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Update:

So I accidentally destroyed my Marshall brass regulator trying to "adjust" the white plastic breather air adjustment screw; yep I stripped it; which is just what it seems it was designed to do.

so now I have no regulator; which I am thinking is an opportunity to get one that has a two spot feed to the service line and add a nipple for a grill tank like others in here have done.

Also, I removed the nipple from the main tank on off valve and opened it all the way and nothing comes out; however the guage is still stuck showing almost full. I noticed the gauge has two screws so I took it off; its basically a magnetic compass style gauge that is reading something metal/magnetic inside the tank and that is the thing that is either stuck, OR I have a full tank of propane and a stuck main valve.

I read many stories on the old push button "auto stop" tank system of the 80's and 90's... and I am thinking that this is all because the guys at the propane fill stops absolutely REFUSE to do step #2 which is open the brass bleeder valve all the way PRIOR to hooking up the hose and turning on the pump. I have decided to take the RV to an RV dealer that also sells propane and go from there on both things.

If I cannot get traction or fixing of this I have decided to Gut the propane system; rip out my 3way dometic, rip out my oven and stove and tank; all of it and go with a dorm fridge with inverter.

I will sell these things at that point to cover the cost of a better inverter and battery bank from Germany.

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Does your tank have spit valve. If it does slowly open it and see what comes out.

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Got a picture?

Even an modern OPD tank has a spit valve.

The old Manchester auto stop tanks have 2 valves for filling a spit valve and control valve that MUST be fully open to fill the tank.

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i'll get a picture tonight. I told that moron at the gas place 10 times that the bleeder valve must be open it even says it must be open on the sticker on the tank. The guy just shrugs and says "Kid I've been doing this for 25 years".

I appreciated being called a kid at age 40, but wrong is wrong. ALL the other times I got a proper fill the valve was opened as it calls for in the instructions.

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I removed the nipple from the main tank on off valve and opened it all the way and nothing comes out; however the guage is still stuck showing almost full.

I assume your tank has a Prestolite valve (POL) and not an OPD. Is it capable of letting gas out when there is no POL male fitting screwed into it? Some won't.

In reference to someone using, or not using the bleeder screw to determine when full . . it is not required IF the guy is weighing the tank instead. Using the bleeder is only necessary if the tank is bolted to your RV and gets filled "in place." And maybe your's is - I have no idea what sort of tank you have.

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it has been my experience two times 2 rigs that the auto stop went bad. and when it does you can not fill the tank at all. you remove all of the autostop stuff and replace the small tube with a whole new bleeder valve. you replace the autostop with a plane new check back filler neck. I HAVE DONE THIS FIX.

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Your tank valve probably will not allow gas out with no back pressure. The tank can not be filled with out opening the bleeder valve it flat will not take propane.

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Yep that knurled knob is the spit valve.

As I understand things :clown2: the valve outlet is a calibrated size hole and when fully opened it lets the cut off retract and you can fill the tank. When liquid comes out of the valve the pressure increases and closes the cut off and cuts off the flow into the tank.

If you don't open the valve all the way the cut off never retracts because there is to much pressure.

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Yep that knurled knob is the spit valve.

As I understand things :clown2: the valve outlet is a calibrated size hole and when fully opened it lets the cut off retract and you can fill the tank. When liquid comes out of the valve the pressure increases and closes the cut off and cuts off the flow into the tank.

If you don't open the valve all the way the cut off never retracts because there is to much pressure.

I have filled quite a few mounted tanks and I honestly can't say what happens if you leave the valve open! I have found that it becomes a serious issue with lots of escaping liquid and am pretty good getting the bleeder closed in a hurry! I do not believe the older tanks had any kind of floats in them so there would be no way to shut off the flow if some one decided to "fill" the tank. The propane fill tanks fill with liquid the pumps only pump some much pressure so if the tank pressure is above the set point pressure of the pump nothing happens so the valve is there to relieve pressure on the camper tank so the tank can be filled.

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So my plan now is to go back and "educate" the "old man" at the propane place citing this site as a resource. I also will open the valve myself before I even pull in, all the way. This way when Mr. "Happy" (I call him this like I would call a linebacker "tiny" as he is drunken with curmudgeon ) goes to fill it works as intended. I am waiting on a regulator on ebay first. I got lucky and scored another Marshall for $10.

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Some say experience is the best teacher. But some people just never seem to get good at what they do, no matter what.

In several different careers I've run into some like that. Even if you try to gently train them they just will never get it. :(

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I find the best students make even better teachers. Also there is a quality to not being an angry curdge; being angry all the time tends to discourage listening which hinders learning.

As I age , I try less and less to let my frustrations rule and instead study what makes things or people tick and use it to my advantage;

This guy that runs the gas shop doesn't want to be told what to do nor does he want to do anything; he wants to hook up the hose turn it on and watch it magically hit the 80%.

By me opening the spit valve for him prior to getting there I am making that happen for him and then he can freak when the gas sprays its final mist when done; wont bother me by then Im out and good according to what you seasoned vets have told me. Thanks fellers!

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Procedure....

hook up propane hose

open spit valve all the way

turn on propane pump

when fill stops OR liquid propane comes out the spit valve stop pump.

Close spit valve

Vent propane filler and remove.

DO NOT drive with the spit valve open, it will vent propane all the time its open and a spark would make a very loud noise.

DO NOT close spit valve with the propane pump running it could lead to overfill

If the spit valve is fully open (you verified) and the tank wont fill. Then its full OR you have a bad fill valve as 5 Toyota suggested.

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WME, whats my option then, remove tank and remove valve (in a safe area)? what if it is full? I have opened the spit valve completely and nothing comes out. So that tells me I am in need of one then. Heck I'm going to get the one 5Toy recommended anyway just to be rid of this issue.

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Well sounds like its either broke or your tank is empty

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Not so easy to weigh a permanently mounted tank.

Linda S

Yeah and the gauges are notoriously inaccurate.

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5Toy do you have the part number for the service valve that the gas leaves the tank from on its way to the stove, furnace etc. That's what I think is failed right now. I am of the mind it broke closed and I have a full tank.

Also, my local RV dealer says they will service the tank so I am thinking I will do the usual; have them unscrew the old valve and assume the risk or use whatever special tools they have while I buy the replacement part.

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Without the regulator installed, in a safe place, slowly crack open the main valve. If nothing comes out your empty, if it vents propane your full. If its full then hook up your new regulator and see if you can get the stove to work.

OR go to the RV place and let then deal with it.

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Or it could be stuck full ; and I mentioned already that I took off the regulator and opened the service valve all the way and nothing comes out; but the gauge is reading 89% full on the tank; the gauge is magnetic; and the thing wouldn't take gas even with the spit open when in KY at jelly stone. So either its empty with a broken gauge and OPD, but functional service valve or its full with a dead service valve.

I'm going to crack it open while outside today before I take it to the RV steelership next Monday. Will report back.

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I don't have the part number sorry.i will do some research on it .if your rv place is any good at all they should be able to tell you what is wrong. I am going to say my guess is that it is empty. but we will have to wait and see.the one I worked on had enough fumes come out of the opening for anybody . I did the job outside in a light breeze. and very carefully.

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