Boondockit Posted September 26, 2016 Author Share Posted September 26, 2016 32 minutes ago, zulandio said: Oh and also your changer is not grounded See my last post not a bus box but an auto reset circuit breaker. Like a fuse that doesn't fry when it trips. Yeah I was typing this as you were typing yours... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boondockit Posted September 26, 2016 Author Share Posted September 26, 2016 22 minutes ago, Boondockit said: Yeah I was typing this as you were typing yours... Just looking at your diagram of your system on previous page and I almost get it, but redundant busses are confusing, can you draw another with your recommended layout (if fast and not a pain) based on what you know about my layout? THANKS!!! Â Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zulandio Posted September 26, 2016 Share Posted September 26, 2016 Â 1 minute ago, Boondockit said: Just looking at your diagram of your system on previous page and I almost get it, but redundant busses are confusing, can you draw another with your recommended layout (if fast and not a pain) based on what you know about my layout? THANKS!!! Â Forget the buses there are none in either of our systems. I did make a diagram for your system already. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zulandio Posted September 26, 2016 Share Posted September 26, 2016 3 minutes ago, Boondockit said: Just looking at your diagram of your system on previous page and I almost get it, but redundant busses are confusing, can you draw another with your recommended layout (if fast and not a pain) based on what you know about my layout? THANKS!!! Â 28 minutes ago, zulandio said: Here is a diagram I made up that should work in your system. Â Â Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boondockit Posted September 26, 2016 Author Share Posted September 26, 2016 23 minutes ago, zulandio said: Â Â YES~! I nearly fully get it, the only thing I am not certain on is where the wires go (+ and - from auto reset to 12v box (please see my pic attached noted with where I "think" they should go), AND I am unsure of where I need thicker gauge wires (and what does gauges should be). I can't thank you enough for getting me this far... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WME Posted September 26, 2016 Share Posted September 26, 2016 What are your plans??? A new power converter or a complete redo with a power Panel Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zero Posted September 26, 2016 Share Posted September 26, 2016 6 hours ago, Boondockit said: YES~! I nearly fully get it, I'm kind of lost in all this. Â At this point, I have no idea what it is you want to do. Â If all you want to do is wire in a power supply in place of that Schumacher - you can do so with a cheap 20 amp unit like this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zero Posted September 26, 2016 Share Posted September 26, 2016 If you've decided you want a complete power center with the AC and DC distribution in one box, but want something small - you can go for this. Â I have no idea what your needs are. Â I know in my case - my Chinook only has a 15 amp converter and it's fine. Â All I ever use it for is lights and a fan. Â My Minicruiser has a 30 amp converter and I never use it for anything. Â Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boondockit Posted September 26, 2016 Author Share Posted September 26, 2016 3 hours ago, jdemaris said: I'm kind of lost in all this.  At this point, I have no idea what it is you want to do.  If all you want to do is wire in a power supply in place of that Schumacher - you can do so with a cheap 20 amp unit like this. I'm getting a lot of help/ideas and I think I am going to do a partial redo with a new converter charger AND some rewiring, changing the order of things a bit (see zulandio' last diagrams towards the bottom of page 3) ...it looks like that should work for more safety and makes it more realistic for me to do (I have no experience and the full redo of everything is out of my league of ability), let me know your thoughts if you want and thanks for all your amazing input to help my decision.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boondockit Posted September 26, 2016 Author Share Posted September 26, 2016 3 hours ago, jdemaris said: If you've decided you want a complete power center with the AC and DC distribution in one box, but want something small - you can go for this. Â I have no idea what your needs are. Â I know in my case - my Chinook only has a 15 amp converter and it's fine. Â All I ever use it for is lights and a fan. Â My Minicruiser has a 30 amp converter and I never use it for anything. Â My needs are exactly the same as yours, lights and fans. Â Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boondockit Posted September 26, 2016 Author Share Posted September 26, 2016 4 hours ago, WME said: What are your plans??? A new power converter or a complete redo with a power Panel I'm getting a lot of help/ideas and I think I am going to do a partial redo with a new converter charger AND some rewiring, changing the order of things a bit (see zulandio' last diagrams towards the bottom of page 3) ...it looks like that should work for more safety and makes it more realistic for me to do (I have no experience and the full redo of everything is out of my league of ability), let me know your thought if you want and thanks for all your amazing input to help my decision.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boondockit Posted September 26, 2016 Author Share Posted September 26, 2016 (edited) 12 hours ago, zulandio said: Here is a diagram I made up that should work in your system. The only thing I dont understand are all the connections to the auto circuit breaker, the one I have has 2 posts and the diagram shows 3 reds and one black (the one to 12v fuse box) how exactly do I connect all these things to the two posts of the one auto circuit breaker? Can I get a sub diagram zoomed in on the auto circuit breaker portion? Edited September 26, 2016 by Boondockit Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WME Posted September 26, 2016 Share Posted September 26, 2016 (edited) The drawing will work, but it does not offer enough protection against shorts. Changes 1 Hook converter + direct to battery +   The converter and the 12 v box are fuse protected by themselves. 2 Hook 12v box + direct to battery +      Hook ALL - to a single point, use the junction block in the 12v box 3 Install a 30-40 amp auto reset CB as close to the isolator as possible, install another CB, same size in the same 12 v wire, as close to the battery as possible. The double CB are to protect from the 30 year old wire from the isolator to the battery from a rub through short. You have 2 high amp power sources hooked to that wire. A single CB protects the battery or the alternator but not both. P.S. I like manual reset CB, if you have to reset it a couple of times in a row you know you have a problem and can start looking. The auto reset will protect things, but will keep resetting until it finally breaks from overload. http://www.ebay.com/itm/50-AMP-Manual-Reset-Circuit-Breaker-12v-24v-Boat-Accessory-Trolling-Motor-/171596826353?hash=item27f3f7c6f1:g:Z1cAAOSwv-NWVQi5&vxp=mtr They come in different sizes    Edited September 26, 2016 by WME Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boondockit Posted September 26, 2016 Author Share Posted September 26, 2016 1 hour ago, WME said: The drawing will work, but it does not offer enough protection against shorts. Changes 1 Hook converter + direct to battery +   The converter and the 12 v box are fuse protected by themselves. 2 Hook 12v box + direct to battery +      Hook ALL - to a single point, use the junction block in the 12v box 3 Install a 30-40 amp auto reset CB as close to the isolator as possible, install another CB, same size in the same 12 v wire, as close to the battery as possible. The double CB are to protect from the 30 year old wire from the isolator to the battery from a rub through short. You have 2 high amp power sources hooked to that wire. A single CB protects the battery or the alternator but not both. P.S. I like manual reset CB, if you have to reset it a couple of times in a row you know you have a problem and can start looking. The auto reset will protect things, but will keep resetting until it finally breaks from overload. http://www.ebay.com/itm/50-AMP-Manual-Reset-Circuit-Breaker-12v-24v-Boat-Accessory-Trolling-Motor-/171596826353?hash=item27f3f7c6f1:g:Z1cAAOSwv-NWVQi5&vxp=mtr They come in different sizes    I have never dealt with these reset circuit breakers, I see they have 2 slightly different colored posts and one is shorter, exactly how do these wire in? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WME Posted September 26, 2016 Share Posted September 26, 2016 copper goes to source and silver is load. So with 2 inline copper to isolator and battery + Â Â Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zulandio Posted September 26, 2016 Share Posted September 26, 2016 (edited) 2 hours ago, Boondockit said: The only thing I dont understand are all the connections to the auto circuit breaker, the one I have has 2 posts and the diagram shows 3 reds and one black (the one to 12v fuse box)  Okay so I got curious and looked into my system and this is how it is setup. You very well may already have an auto CB by the isolator I already do. I made a mistake and the other black wire coming off the Auto CB in the diagram I made for you is supposed to be red as well.. Edited September 26, 2016 by zulandio Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boondockit Posted September 26, 2016 Author Share Posted September 26, 2016 (edited) Can you make that a little more simple? if you wish, break it down as far as it can go...I am a ridiculous noob  I don't get it... Edited September 26, 2016 by Boondockit Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WME Posted September 27, 2016 Share Posted September 27, 2016 (edited) Go back to the first drawing you posted, follow it. The 110v breaker panel and 110v wall outlets are already wired so ignore them. The 12v loads are already wired so ignore them. The only wiring you need to do is converter + to battery+, fuse box + to battery+ and isolator to battery+ with proper CB. Connect all the grounds or - to the block in the 12v box. See the pic below. Edited September 27, 2016 by WME Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WME Posted September 27, 2016 Share Posted September 27, 2016 (edited) On ‎9‎/‎25‎/‎2016 at 2:22 PM, Boondockit said:  This is helpful thanks! I I am comparing my things to your and I have attached a pic with a red circle around it, what is that exactly that I am circling and what is it's purpose? I'm curious for my mapping purposes with wiring That's your ground block ALL of the 12V - or grounds go here. There should one wire that goes from the block to the frame Edited September 27, 2016 by WME Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zulandio Posted September 27, 2016 Share Posted September 27, 2016 1 hour ago, Boondockit said: Can you make that a little more simple? if you wish, break it down as far as it can go...I am a ridiculous noob  I don't get it...  Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boondockit Posted September 27, 2016 Author Share Posted September 27, 2016 (edited) 11 hours ago, WME said:  3 Install a 30-40 amp auto reset CB as close to the isolator as possible, install another CB, same size in the same 12 v wire, as close to the battery as possible.  Quote Ok, so by inline I think you simply mean that for the first CB  (closer to isolater) that it's just the copper end facing the isolator (wire goes from copper post to isolator) and the the other post is wired to the battery, (just a single wire on each post and the breaker is a bridge)  for the 2nd CB (closer to battery) it's basically the same with the copper facing the isolator and the other facing the battery (again only one wire on each post with the breaker like a bridge)...am I getting it ???  Quote   Edited September 27, 2016 by Boondockit Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zero Posted September 27, 2016 Share Posted September 27, 2016 I am lost in all the electronic trivia.  Back to the original problem and post.  If all is wanted is the ability for shore-power to create enough DC power to runs some lights and a fan?  All is needed is a $30 power supply wired in parallel along with that existing Schumacher battery maintainer.  Have both.  The power-supply makes DC when camping.  The Schumacher gets plugged in when then RV is in storarge to keep the "house" battery charged.  Easy to do and no rewiring.  If you want to re-do it all, that is fine too.  You did at one time, express the desire for simplicity. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maineah Posted September 27, 2016 Share Posted September 27, 2016 If you have a modern charger/converter you can leave it plugged in. No need for a battery maintainer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boondockit Posted September 27, 2016 Author Share Posted September 27, 2016 (edited) 1 hour ago, jdemaris said: I am lost in all the electronic trivia.  Back to the original problem and post.  If all is wanted is the ability for shore-power to create enough DC power to runs some lights and a fan?  All is needed is a $30 power supply wired in parallel along with that existing Schumacher battery maintainer.  Have both.  The power-supply makes DC when camping.  The Schumacher gets plugged in when then RV is in storarge to keep the "house" battery charged.  Easy to do and no rewiring.  If you want to re-do it all, that is fine too.  You did at one time, express the desire for simplicity. I didn't specifically imply it but always wanted the battery to charge while shore power was plugged in, I understand exactly what you're saying and maybe just adding a simple power supply is an option, but per the original post, when I poke the leads coming out of the Schumacher (while plugged into shore power) I get zero juice, maybe it needs a battery telling it to send it? I know the outlet feeding the Schumacher is good because I tested it Edited September 27, 2016 by Boondockit Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boondockit Posted September 27, 2016 Author Share Posted September 27, 2016 18 minutes ago, Maineah said: If you have a modern charger/converter you can leave it plugged in. No need for a battery maintainer. Right, the Schumacher was (in my mind) getting the axe as soon as you guys started giving me info... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zero Posted September 27, 2016 Share Posted September 27, 2016 4 minutes ago, Boondockit said: Right, the Schumacher was (in my mind) getting the axe as soon as you guys started giving me info... Yes, and that is fine. Â Or you can buy a cheaper power-supply with no optional charger and just use what you have. Â That Schumacher is fine for that job. Â Just plug it in when you have the rig parked. Â A power-supply is only $30. Â You won't find a power-center or a converter with a charger new for that kind of price. Â I don't care either way. Â You DID ask so I am mentioning possibilities. Â You already have a good battery maintainer. Â So it seems all you need is a power-supply. Â Note that such a power-supply will keep your "house" battery from getting discharged when actually camping and plugged into "shore power." Â It just won't go up to 14 volts. Â It will maintain at around 12.5 volts which is fine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WME Posted September 27, 2016 Share Posted September 27, 2016 Get the converter, your not a electron guy. KISS. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boondockit Posted September 27, 2016 Author Share Posted September 27, 2016 (edited) 6 hours ago, jdemaris said: Yes, and that is fine.  Or you can buy a cheaper power-supply with no optional charger and just use what you have.  That Schumacher is fine for that job.  Just plug it in when you have the rig parked.  A power-supply is only $30.  You won't find a power-center or a converter with a charger new for that kind of price.  I don't care either way.  You DID ask so I am mentioning possibilities.  You already have a good battery maintainer.  So it seems all you need is a power-supply.  Note that such a power-supply will keep your "house" battery from getting discharged when actually camping and plugged into "shore power."  It just won't go up to 14 volts.  It will maintain at around 12.5 volts which is fine. Thanks, like I said in the original post the Schumacher show no sign of current going out of leads when plugged into shore power (the outlet is fine) , although I am curious if my meter read zero because it actually needs an undercharged battery to stimulate so that it gives a charge (you would think my meter on the leads out would do it though)... I like Jdemaris's suggestion to just add a power supply in parallel) , if I thought the Schumacher was working I would actually do that...  Edited September 27, 2016 by Boondockit Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boondockit Posted September 27, 2016 Author Share Posted September 27, 2016 (edited) 5 hours ago, WME said: Get the converter, your not a electron guy. KISS. Ha, that's putting it lightly, I actually like your plan of the re-wiring along with the inline CBs (although actually this would be more work than Jdemaris's suggestion to just add a power supply in parallel) , if I thought the Schumacher was working I would actually do that (adding a power supply in parallel to Schumacher)... Edited September 27, 2016 by Boondockit Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boondockit Posted September 27, 2016 Author Share Posted September 27, 2016 On September 26, 2016 at 1:59 PM, WME said: The drawing will work, but it does not offer enough protection against shorts. Changes 1 Hook converter + direct to battery +   The converter and the 12 v box are fuse protected by themselves. 2 Hook 12v box + direct to battery +      Hook ALL - to a single point, use the junction block in the 12v box 3 Install a 30-40 amp auto reset CB as close to the isolator as possible, install another CB, same size in the same 12 v wire, as close to the battery as possible. The double CB are to protect from the 30 year old wire from the isolator to the battery from a rub through short. You have 2 high amp power sources hooked to that wire. A single CB protects the battery or the alternator but not both. P.S. I like manual reset CB, if you have to reset it a couple of times in a row you know you have a problem and can start looking. The auto reset will protect things, but will keep resetting until it finally breaks from overload. http://www.ebay.com/itm/50-AMP-Manual-Reset-Circuit-Breaker-12v-24v-Boat-Accessory-Trolling-Motor-/171596826353?hash=item27f3f7c6f1:g:Z1cAAOSwv-NWVQi5&vxp=mtr They come in different sizes    WME I wrote this yesterday but not sure you saw it, super important to me; Ok, so by inline I think you simply mean that for the first CB  (closer to isolater) that it's just the copper end facing the isolator (wire goes from copper post to isolator) and the the other post is wired to the battery, (just a single wire on each post and the breaker is a bridge).  For the 2nd CB (closer to battery) it's basically the same with the copper facing the isolator and the other facing the battery (again only one wire on each post with the breaker like a bridge)...am I getting it ??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maineah Posted September 28, 2016 Share Posted September 28, 2016 (edited) The converter /charger is simple fix for your problem in the future if you add more 12 volt stuff you will have the power to run any thing you want the difference for instance between a 25 amp and a 45 amp converter is less than $10 and still under $200. Not only does it give you the 12 volt power it also gives you the extra power to charge your battery far faster than any maintainer ever will. It also simplifies your wiring. The terminals on the converter will except 2 #8 wires one to the battery one to your 12 volt load center the protection is at the converter via it's 30 amp fuses. If you want to go overboard a 35 amp breaker at the battery to protect a short piece of wire. http://www.bestconverter.com/Inteli-Power-PD9140A_p_12.html#.V-sdZ_krJhE add the charge wizard and you have an out standing system for under $200 Edited September 28, 2016 by Maineah Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WME Posted September 28, 2016 Share Posted September 28, 2016 2 hours ago, Boondockit said: WME I wrote this yesterday but not sure you saw it, super important to me; Ok, so by inline I think you simply mean that for the first CB  (closer to isolater) that it's just the copper end facing the isolator (wire goes from copper post to isolator) and the the other post is wired to the battery, (just a single wire on each post and the breaker is a bridge).  For the 2nd CB (closer to battery) it's basically the same with the copper facing the isolator and the other facing the battery (again only one wire on each post with the breaker like a bridge)...am I getting it ??? 2nd CB copper to battery... The CB trips when if the old wire shorts, So the battery is the source in this case. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boondockit Posted September 28, 2016 Author Share Posted September 28, 2016 18 minutes ago, WME said: 2nd CB copper to battery... The CB trips when if the old wire shorts, So the battery is the source in this case. Ahh, excellent thanks for your time and expertise... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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