'78 Newport Chinook Project

[MontanaChinook]

I bought this back in September. Didn't like the color someone painted the inside, and there was some water damage, so I wanted to replace the interior walls. Of course, that turned into gutting it and pretty much replacing everything in it. I bought some insulation, tires, wheels, new faucet, new furnace, new converter, will replace most of the wiring, wire some speakers into the back and get a new stereo, new led bulbs for the coach, do new counter tops, table, walls...eventually new cushions and upholstery.

I've pretty much gutted it as much as I plan to. I've been convinced to let a professional wire the 120V for the new converter, then I'll start on the 12V system. Then the new furnace. Then whatever wiring I plan on replacing. Insulation. Then new walls. Finally new cabinets, counter tops (hopefully some nice hardwood veneer), and whatever finishing touches it needs. At some point along the way I'll get the new tires and wheels put on.

It WILL be in use by June!

Luckily it doesn't need much mechanically. 48,000 miles, and well used, but not abused. Just needs an oil change, full tune up (plugs, wires, cap, valve adjustment, belts, air filter, carb adjustments), new wheel bearings all the way around. At some point before too long I'll get new shocks and look into adding a leaf to the spring pack. Probably could use a flush of clutch and brake fluid. I may change out the clutch, just because, but we'll see.

A roll of Innovative Insulation Double-Bubble, Progressive Dynamics Mighty Mini 4045, Suburban NT 16SEQ furnace. Some Hankook RA08s. I don't think my fridge works, but I've decided not to spend that money at this point...3-way fridge is just really expensive.

[zero]

I'm doing exactly the same on my 78, but mine is a pop-up and set up a little differently, Also the 78 pop-up is quite different from all the older Chinook pop-ups and I've yet to find any good photos of another that's been redone. Lots of 76s, 75s, etc. but no 78s.

The reflective "bubble' insulation has no R value. Only has "reflective" value. Better then nothing I guess. 1/2" - 1" of foam will do much more for heat protection and sound deadening.

I need new paneling both for the walls and new cabinets I'm going to make. I did not find it easy to find good quality and thin real wood paneling. Last time I bought paneling was 30 years ago and things have changed a bit. The original Chinook paneling is 1/8" thick and garbage. I tried to find some real wood paneling with or without veneer and found nothing locally (Lowes and Home Depot). Local lumber yards don't stock it anymore. I finally got some stuff at Lowes for $40 a sheet that is .20" thick, 100% wood, three ply with the exterior maple veneer.

In regard to your fridge - have you tried to service it? I ask because my record on old three-way fridges has been 100%. Every one I've found worked well after cleaning out the burning, pilot jet, etc. and maybe installed a new thermocouple. That being said, I probably won't use the three-way in my Chinook. My camping is just about always stop-and-go and sleeping in a different place each night. For that, an electric fridge works much nicer. Since I'm installing a 3000 watt inverter in back anyway, I'm just going to use a cheap AC fridge - dorm sized. $75 new. I have the same setup in an other RV and it has worked flawlessly. So much easier then propane for travel. Always on, no turning the gas on an off, getting the pilot lit, etc. Having a high amp inverter though requires having the aux battery in back no more then 5 feet from the inverter. On my Chinook, I'm using the prior propane tank compartment for batteries. Works great and is vented. Propane tank is now on the back bumper. I extended the back bumper out 6" so it's more useful as a shelf for carrying things.

I see your Chinook roof is poorly made just as mine is. Are any of your wood braces rotted or broken?

[MontanaChinook]

The wood braces don't seem rotten...definitely not broken. I'll take a closer look.

What was the paneling you bought, exactly? I will very soon be running into the same thing, so that would be helpful.

I wonder if there's space for a little foam along with the bubble...most of the searching I did for rv insulation was coming up with reflective bubble stuff, so that's what I bought. I want some heat and cool kept in, but especially heat kept out. It'll be sitting in the sun with expensive musical instruments and a dog in it fairly often. I mean I'll always try to find shade and never park and leave the dog where he'll boil, but I was hoping some radiant heat barrier would allow more exposure/time out in the sun than I can currently get away with.

I honestly don't know about the fridge. I was told it didn't work, and at this point, the Chinook is parked for the winter, on a good slant, so I'm not going to try it till I have some flat ground. I'm willing to try cleaning and replacing a couple things and giving it a shot. Until then, it's an icebox, and that's fine. I won't pay the money for a new one, and I just bought a new converter and don't plan on switching to an inverter anytime soon.

The yahoo Chinook group has photo albums that might have photos of one like yours. Unless you've checked already. I know some of them had an interior set up more like the Newport/Omegas, with the stove and fridge on one side, sink on the other, and a bed where you sleep across the width of the vehicle instead of along the length, like most pop tops.

[getout]

This looks like it's going to be fun. I started into a Sunrader project but haven't gotten too far yet. It's been cold and I've been doing house projects.

I've always really like these tiny toyotas. I'll be excited to see what you do with the rebuild.

[MontanaChinook]

It'll be fun.

It's more or less going back together exactly how it was, but with new appliances and countertops, plus insulation. But I'll probably find a way to get a little more counter space and storage.

If nothing else, new walls with insulation, new surfaces, plus a more efficient, quieter converter and furnace will be a huge improvement.

[zero]

The wood braces don't seem rotten...definitely not broken. I'll take a closer look.

What was the paneling you bought, exactly? I will very soon be running into the same thing, so that would be helpful.

I wonder if there's space for a little foam along with the bubble...most of the searching I did for rv insulation was coming up with reflective bubble stuff, so that's what I bought. I want some heat and cool kept in, but especially heat kept out. It'll be sitting in the sun with expensive musical instruments and a dog in it fairly often. I mean I'll always try to find shade and never park and leave the dog where he'll boil, but I was hoping some radiant heat barrier would allow more exposure/time out in the sun than I can currently get away with.

I honestly don't know about the fridge. I was told it didn't work, and at this point, the Chinook is parked for the winter, on a good slant, so I'm not going to try it till I have some flat ground. I'm willing to try cleaning and replacing a couple things and giving it a shot. Until then, it's an icebox, and that's fine. I won't pay the money for a new one, and I just bought a new converter and don't plan on switching to an inverter anytime soon.

The yahoo Chinook group has photo albums that might have photos of one like yours. Unless you've checked already. I know some of them had an interior set up more like the Newport/Omegas, with the stove and fridge on one side, sink on the other, and a bed where you sleep across the width of the vehicle instead of along the length, like most pop tops.

I've been through all their photos. No good photos setup like mine. Seems in only 1978 - the location of the furnace, fridge, water tank, etc. got moved. On the 1978 pop-ups the fridge and propane cooktop are just behind the driver's seat and the furnace is to the rear on the passenger side.

The foil-bubble stuff e.g. "reflectex" has no insulating value. It does have reflective value and can help ward off sunlight. My Chinook came from the factory with flexible foam on the walls. Any foam is better than the foil but since there are so many curves - sheets don't work very well. Spray on would. Reflective foil with spray-on foam would work real well.

The paneling I got was from Lowes item # 80246. Sold as " premium underlayment" but nice looking stuff and all wood (real 3 ply plywood). No fiber board or MDF with a paper-thin layer on the OD or fake veneer. $20 per sheet. Home Depot sells Luan underlayment that also is 100% wood but I like the looks of the stuff from Lowes better. The Luan is more homogenous and has less character (grain variations, knots, etc.). Both are solid wood and much better then any paneling I found. I know I said I'd gotten maple but I'd forgotten I changed my mind at the last minute. The maple was $40 a sheet, have and a little over 1/4" thick. This "superply" pine I got is less then 1/4" and half the price. Actual measurement is 7/32". Don't believe the mistakes in the specs at the Lowes website.

I'm not trying to talk you into an inverter setup - but figured I'd mention that a "converter" and an "inverter" are not mutually exclusive. A good system has both. The converter makes DC from AC when available - and the inverter makes AC from DC which is always available.

How is your door lock? I pulled mine all apart and lubed but seems finding a new lock cylinder for it is near impossible. Lock was made by Keeler and long obsolete.

[MontanaChinook]

Door locks work but could be lubed. But even brand new, they didn't provide much security...

So will that paneling bend with my walls? It's all very curvy on the inside...

I agree, in all the photos I've seen, I've never seen the utilities up at the back of the cab.

[zero]

Door locks work but could be lubed. But even brand new, they didn't provide much security...

So will that paneling bend with my walls? It's all very curvy on the inside...

I agree, in all the photos I've seen, I've never seen the utilities up at the back of the cab.

No problem bending it and conforming to curves.

[WME]

Insulating http://www.frugal-mariner.com/Insulating.html

Waterproof paneling is FRP available at Lowes and Home Depot http://www.frpshop.com/liner-panels-c-3_4.html

[MontanaChinook]

No problem bending it and conforming to curves.

Good!

And that's good to know that an inverter is still possible, down the road. I'm also leaving open the option to put a solar panel in at some point, even if just wired to utilities and not a battery bank, just so I'm using sunlight during the day, not draining the battery at all until night.

[MontanaChinook]

Insulating http://www.frugal-mariner.com/Insulating.html

Waterproof paneling is FRP avaiable at Lowes and Home Depot http://www.frpshop.com/liner-panels-c-3_4.html

Thanks! That's basically the insulation I got. I think maybe the innovative insulation double-bubble might be a slight step up from reflectix, but same idea, and that's one of the links somebody posted on another thread here that got me leaning towards the bubble/foil insulation instead of foam.

Interesting paneling...I'm definitely leaning towards wood, mostly for looks, but I'll need to see what kind of prices I'm looking at. If one is way more expensive than the other, that might determine what I do in the end.

[MontanaChinook]

I see your Chinook roof is poorly made just as mine is. Are any of your wood braces rotted or broken?

My roof seems to be metal supports running across the width of the vehicle, and maybe wood going between them along the length, with some wood blocks placed in areas where screws needed to secure something to the roof. Is that the same as yours?

[zero]

Insulating http://www.frugal-mariner.com/Insulating.html

Waterproof paneling is FRP available at Lowes and Home Depot http://www.frpshop.com/liner-panels-c-3_4.html

That poly-foam in the first link looks perfect for a curved-wall Chinook. It's similar to what was factory installed.

In regard to the paneling - I saw the stuff you linked. It's fine as far as durability goes but I wanted real wood. If someone wants real wood paneling - finding real multi-ply wood instead of some product with a paper-thin veneer is not easy to find (at a reasonable price). The thin veneer stuff is not very forgiving and gets messed up pretty easy;

[zero]

My roof seems to be metal supports running across the width of the vehicle, and maybe wood going between them along the length, with some wood blocks placed in areas where screws needed to secure something to the roof. Is that the same as yours?

Yes, mine has 1" square alumium tubing sideways along with wood here and there. Many of the spots with wood are cracked and separated with the sideways pieces join the perimeter. I know that my Chinook manual states that NO additional weight ever can be put on the roof. Sounds like two feet of snow, or even someone temporarily climbing on the roof can do a number on it. I've seen many, many, badly sagging Chinook roofs.

[MontanaChinook]

As long as my roof can handle a canoe...I'd be happy. Or maybe one small solar panel. My roof supports are all intact. Maybe rotten...but they look fine through the fiberglass.

My Chinook had no insulation when I opened up the walls. The roof has that faux leather (pleather), stretched over some mattress foam type stuff, on really thin board. That's the only thing that would qualify as insulation in the whole vehicle.

That polyethylene foam in rolls is a good idea...the guy I talked to about the foil said I need something like 1/4" of space on one side for it to be effective. It doesn't look like they did that. Wonder if I'd have space for one layer of foil and one layer of foam, with a small gap, without having to build out my studs a little...not a big deal on the sides, but if I lower the roof even a fraction of an inch, I won't be able to stand up straight in there anymore.

[MontanaChinook]

Well, throw another $100 onto the project...just ordered some foam. Sound dampening and insulation are important to me. I really did tell myself, when I bought this, that I wouldn't let it turn into an expensive project, and I'd just "use it". Right!!

[getout]

I really did tell myself, when I bought this, that I wouldn't let it turn into an expensive project, and I'd just "use it". Right!!

HAHA! I keep thinking the exact same thing!

[MontanaChinook]

[zero]

As long as my roof can handle a canoe...I'd be happy. Or maybe one small solar panel.

When I got working on my roof I discovered a small solar panel up there. Before that, I had no idea it was there. About 12" X 30". Maybe that's what did my roof in once upon a time. Not the solar panel . . but the guy climbing on the roof to install it. It was hardwired to a small sealed-in-epoxy cube stuck inside the converter. Must be an old solar-controller of some sort.

My Chinook had 3/4" thick polystyrene foam board on the entire ceiling and it looks like it was OEM. The curved walls all had flexible foam maybe 1/2" thick.

In regard to the reflective foil type stuff and an air layer - yeah - but trapped air adds insulation value to anything -foil or no foil. That's why the old house storm windows worked so well that you don't see much anymore. Back when single pane glass windows were common and glass storms with wooden sashes got installed every fall. Left a good 4" to 6" of trapped air. They fogged and iced up something awful but had a pretty good insulating qualities as compared to the double or triple glazed windows used today. Even the polyiso foam board insulation is often used in conjunction with a 1/2" to 1" air space to add R value. Not something I'm going to strive for in a limited space RV. Foam has enough air already trapped inside of it suit me (as long as it's closed cell). But that leads me to another gripe about the propane refrigerators. All the venting needed and air intrusion they result in.

I'm probably going to mount a pair of 100 watt panels on the roof but the mounts that hold the panels will only be on the edges of the roof and no weight in the middle.

I know exactly what you mean by not intending to make a huge project out of something - yet with me - it always winds up that way. I cannot leave "well enough" or "bad enough" alone.

I spent four years on my last RV project (a diesel 4WD Blazer Hallmark). But once I felt it was "done" , I kind of lost interest in it. In addition, just around when I got it done, diesel prices went nuts. So, now the perfect RV - at least in my mind - is a gas powered Toyota. We'll see.

[MontanaChinook]

Yeah, that's the way it goes!

Well, I'll figure out how I want to do the insulation. As long as the foil doesn't NEED air space to reflect radiant heat, I won't worry too much about it.

I actually think my rv has already been partially re wired at some point...so I wonder if insulation was taken out and not replaced...

Anyways, I'll post again when there's been some more progress!

[MontanaChinook]

Just some more photos before it starts going back together.

New converter, other new stuff like tires and insulation, more exterior photos, photo of the infamous rear "fat tire", and the Subaru thrown in just to make JDemaris jealous. Along with the "junk pile". Can't wait to clear that crap out of my garage.

[Dolphinite no longer here]

Well, looks like you're ready to get that pesky Chinook back together! Looks like Helena has about the same amount of snow that Kalispell does. Its gonna' be a dry fire season!

Judging by the empties, I'd say you have excellent taste in beer...

John

[MontanaChinook]

Yeah, it's mud city here. 52 and sunny is the forecast for Saturday. Burn baby burn...

Yep, getting close!

Yeah...that's almost embarrassing, but not really The only place that takes bottles is the transfer station, and only renting my house, I don't have a dump pass. So my recycling builds up for a long time..

[zero]

, and the Subaru thrown in just to make JDemaris jealous.

I haven't seen a Loyale wagon that rust free in 10-15 years. I didn't think any existed on planet earth anymore. And yeah, I'm envious. I love those cars and would take a clean one any day over any of my newer gas-guzzling Stuper-oos.

I've never been able to wear one out - just had to watch them rot out until the rear frame-crossmember broke and two. Any of my 5 speed standard-shift 4WD wagons with the 1.8 engines got near 30 MPG in the summer. The 3 speed automatics not quite so good.

[MontanaChinook]

Make a trip out west someday. They're all over the place!

[zero]

Make a trip out west someday. They're all over the place!

I've got two sons living in Colorado who have been keeping an eye open for me. So far, the Loyales they've come across were 2WD, not 4WD. If a cheap rust-free 4WD turns up, I'll buy it. My one kid said he'd drive it to NY on his next visit if I paid for the gas. He'd then fly back home like he usually does.

[MontanaChinook]

I guess since we're in the mountains, 2wds are pretty rare. If someone wanted to, they could buy and sell 4wd Loyales and GLs monthly. A friend of mine had three GLs recently. One for parts, the others he was driving.

[MontanaChinook]

Progress. New converter is in and 120V is wired, new furnace is in place but not wired or connected yet, and I've got the foil insulation everywhere except the cab-over. I also sealed the windows as best I could, but I think some of the moisture is from the rubber and other seals in the window tracks, not the actual frames...so we'll see how dry they stay. Luckily it's not as much of an issue where I live.

[Derek up North]

Well, at least now you won't have to wear your hat inside any more!

[MontanaChinook]

Yeah, as long as I'm in the Chinook, no mind control can get to me!!

[Derek up North]

As long as you stay away from the windows. Unless you get the curtains lined with tin foil too.

[MontanaChinook]

Well of course that's the plan.

You wouldn't believe how much extra foil I'm going have to left over. So of course, all the windows will be getting custom shaped reflective sun shades. I probably won't actually back the curtains with them...but I will have reflective shades for each window.

And probably still more foil insulation than I'll ever know what to do with. I should actually just make a cover for the entire Chinook. Fold it up and bring it with me wherever I go. When I park out in the sun, I'll just use it like a giant RV cover, and no radiant heat will even touch the outside!!

I honestly almost have that much foil...

[WME]

If your parking in one place for awhile. Make over sized windows shades and attach them OUTSIDE the windows. Velcro or magnets work.

Using the shades insides, the heat is traped between the foil and the window and the will leak inside. With the covers outside the windows are in the shade.

Foil on the inside works great in the winter mode.

[MontanaChinook]

Thanks! Some of this will be for if I park somewhere in Southern Utah, and backpack for a couple nights. I'd probably have some stuff inside that I don't want to bake, but...you never know, someone might mess with the shades if they're outside. I guess my best bet would be to make some that will work inside or outside, depending on what I need at the time.

[MontanaChinook]

I taped the seams of the foil, pulled up almost all the tiles from the old floor, and this...this makes me very happy.

The old seat was uncomfortable. Not uncomfortable after a long drive, an hour or so, or even a half hour. Just immediately uncomfortable when I sat down. Things poking me in the lumbar, padding worn out etc.

It was really nice...since I don't weld, or really have a lot of fabrication skills, I brainstormed quite a bit on how to get around welding new tracks, or of course, doing a cheap hack job of it. All I had to do was drill 4 holes in my old seat tracks, one for each of the four tracks, so I could bolt my existing tracks onto the new seats, and just bolt the tracks into the existing holes in the floor. They feel solid, and slide smoothly. Pretty nice!