Derek up North Posted February 5, 2013 Share Posted February 5, 2013 You might want to consider buying shocks designed for a 'lifted' truck. Only measuring will tell. Too short (or too long) a shock will ruin them in short order. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zero Posted February 5, 2013 Share Posted February 5, 2013 You might want to consider buying shocks designed for a 'lifted' truck. Only measuring will tell. Too short (or too long) a shock will ruin them in short order. I did some research and found that the Monroe spring-assist shocks for my 1985 Isuzu P'U{P are the perfect size for my 1978 Toyota. They are 2" longer. But I already have the new ones that I can't use and now - I'm not sure I'm even going to need them after adding leafs. So I'm going to wait until I get driving this Toyota and see how it goes as it is. I might just stick the Monroes for sale here some time. They were $60 new and it's kind of a shame to waste them. Monroe Sensa-trac # 58486. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stevo Posted February 5, 2013 Share Posted February 5, 2013 More questions as usual please... 1) What size socket fits the lug nuts on the 1 ton axle wheels? 23mm? 2) I couldn't find a lug nut wrench at Harbor Freight that fits the lug nuts on the 1 ton axle. Where can I buy a lug nut wrench that will fit? 3) Should I replace the u-joints even though both Sunraders have only 60,000 original miles on them? 4) How much did the u-joints cost you? 5) When ordering new u-joints, should I ask for "u-joints for an 82 Toyota pickup truck" - or something different since I will now be connecting the drive shaft to a 1 ton differential? 6) Is a torque wrench required when replacing the u-joints? 7) What is the Axle Breather for? Thanks again Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sunrading Arkansas Posted February 6, 2013 Author Share Posted February 6, 2013 (edited) @jdemaris - Definitely looks like she's riding low. Love your place (except I'd sing a different tune in the dead of winter)! @Stevo 1&2) My lugs took a 15/16 standard socket. 3-6) Don't attempt to replace u-joints by yourself, especially without experience. There are u-clips that have to be removed and then the u-joints have to be punched out with a drift (or u-joint puller if your into spending money on stuff). Then the new ones have to be pressed (or drifted) back in tightly. If I hadn't had someone to help me I would have outsourced this to my local hungry mechanic. But as for cost, mine were the most expensive (and smallest) of the 3 available for the 83 Toyota Pickup DLX (3x $23). My Sunrader only has 35k miles, but I replaced mine so I could grease them - the factory ones aren't greaseable. Plus, I'm gearing up for a 7500mi Western US trip this summer and trying to fix u-joints/drive shaft breakage in Death Valley or some other unforsaken place is not something I want to worry about. 7) The axle breather allows air expansion in the axle to vent rather then blow your axle seals. The factory breather looks like a mushroom cap on top of the axle/diff. on the drivers side. Mine was missing and plugged with a bolt (probably why the seals blew) so I rigged one like the Mudders & 4x4ers do - mainly because it was cheaper than buying a new one from the factory. I would suggest removing yours and cleaning it. Edited February 6, 2013 by Sunrading Arkansas Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stevo Posted February 6, 2013 Share Posted February 6, 2013 Okay thanks again. I will have a mechanic do the u-joints. You said you used 1" spacers for your rear shocks to keep the shocks "true and straight." Are those 1" spacers something I can buy at a regular auto parts store? Did you use Monroe load adjusting shocks for the front shocks too? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sunrading Arkansas Posted February 6, 2013 Author Share Posted February 6, 2013 (edited) @Stevo - No, I built the spacers out of steel tubing cut to 1" length. I cannot recommend that as safe as I believe I'm the first to jerry-rig mine like that and it is untested. As for the front shocks I had to go with standard Monroes as the front control arm design doesn't allow a "beefier" shock...and I'm too cheap to buy Bilsteins. Edited February 6, 2013 by Sunrading Arkansas Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zero Posted February 6, 2013 Share Posted February 6, 2013 Okay thanks again. I will have a mechanic do the u-joints. You said you used 1" spacers for your rear shocks to keep the shocks "true and straight." Are those 1" spacers something I can buy at a regular auto parts store? Did you use Monroe load adjusting shocks for the front shocks too? DOM tubing makes good HD spacers. You can order it by the inch at several on-line metal sellers. That is the standard type of steel stock for making bushings. It's basically thick-wall pipe. You can also buy premade HD bushings on-line from places like Mcmaster.com Small U-joints like Toyota uses can be pressed in and out in a bench vise if you own one. Bench vise and two sockets from your tool box. One big enough that the U-joint cap can pass through it, and the other smaller then the cap OD. One socket on each side, sit in a vice and then tigthen the vise to press apart. The cap ODs are around 1 1/8" so for one side, you need a big socket or spacer with a hole big enough for the cap to pass through. I have a U-joint press and a regular 50 ton hydraulic press but I don't use either when replacing small U-joints. A common bench vise is the easiest. DOM (drawn over mandrel) steel sells by OD and wall thickness. If you wanted something to make bushings to slide over a 1/2" bolt - it's 40 cents per inch or $4 per foot. Not sure which size you want but here's one example: http://www.speedymetals.com/ps-3434-204-78-od-x-035-wall-dom-steel-tube.aspx You can also order premade spacers e.g. .. http://www.mcmaster.com/#unthreaded-spacers/=lczdwe Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stevo Posted February 7, 2013 Share Posted February 7, 2013 Some forums have "Thank you" buttons and this forum needs one. Thanks again guys! Okay, more questions please... 1) Where exactly did you use those spacers? 2) What is the recommended wall thickness for those spacers? 3) What is the recommended material I should get for the spacers? Is zinc plated steel okay like the ones at mcmaster http://www.mcmaster.com/#unthreaded-spacers/=ld9h76 ? 4) I could NOT remove the 1 ton wheel lug nuts with a pneumatic impact drive today set at 100 PSI and then 120 PSI even though I pre-sprayed them with WD-40 (they aren't rusty anyway), and I know the driver side duallys were just removed a couple months ago the day I bought it. How do you guys remove those? What is the recommended PSI for the impact drive? (Some guy at Pep Boys said dually lug nuts could be from 180 PSI to 200 PSI) Should I buy a big pipe to slip over my 18" breaker bar to get leverage? Inquiring freaking minds want to know. =:^P 5) I see your axle breather tube is connected to the top of the differential but where does it go after that? Thanks P.S. Sunrading Arkansas - I forgot to congratulate you before, so CONGRATULATIONS on getting your axle done! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sunrading Arkansas Posted February 7, 2013 Author Share Posted February 7, 2013 (edited) 1-3) I used my spacer (thick wall pipe stock I had lying around) as a sleeve around the hardened steel bolts that came with my Monroe Load Adjusting shocks on the inside of the frame rail. Note here is my mount assembily: Bolt- washer - [frame] - thick (1/4") washer that came with shock - 1" spacer- then standard shock washer- upper shock- another shock washer- then lock nut.....again I cannot recommend this setup as I'm not a suspension professional and it has not been tested. 4) Are you sure it doesn't have left hand thread studs. If not, heating with a torch always seems to convince things to unstick. I bought the new liquid torch penetrate style WD-40 and it worked on everything stubborn I had. 5) I routed my axle breather hose over and down the frame and ziptied it off under the fiberglass behind the driver's side wheel well and capped it with a lawnmower fuel filter to keep dust out. You just want it to "flow" downhill toward the axle so no axle lube can accidentally settle in the hose - blocking airflow. And thanks for the congrats. It was made possible by this site. Glad I can "pay it forward." Edited February 7, 2013 by Sunrading Arkansas Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stevo Posted February 7, 2013 Share Posted February 7, 2013 The thing is that these lug bolts and nuts aren't rusty at all and the duallys on the drivers side were both removed a month ago. I assumed the nuts come off counter clockwise but I tried both ways. Aren't all of them counter clockwise to remove? Did you use a pneumatic drive to remove your lug nuts? If so, how much psi did you use? If not, what did you use to remove the lug nuts? (I can't find a big "T" shaped lug nut wrench with a 23mm socket!) Do you use one of those blow torches with a propane tank to heat it up? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zero Posted February 7, 2013 Share Posted February 7, 2013 3) What is the recommended material I should get for the spacers? Is zinc plated steel okay like the ones at mcmaster http://www.mcmaster.com/#unthreaded-spacers/=ld9h76 ? 4) I could NOT remove the 1 ton wheel lug nuts with a pneumatic impact drive today set at 100 PSI and then 120 PSI even though I pre-sprayed them with WD-40 The only cocern with the aloy of the spacers is for rust protection. Hardness and tensile strength not a big issue. Wall thickness yes. Don't use thin-wall water pipe. Use DOM. Zinc-plated steel is just a cheap way of give steel a small degree of rust resistance. Paint it after installed and you'll be fine. Lug nuts get stuck - especially on Toyota 1/2 ton axles. Can''t say I've had a problem with the 1 ton duallies after a little heat is used.. If any of the nuts are left-hand the stud should have an "L" stamped in the middle. WD40 will accomplish nothing in regards to freeing something that is stuck from rust. I can't say I ever round any "rust-breaker" chemical that did much on something really stuck from rust -but WD40 is a "water displacement" chemical - not a rust-breaker -that's what "WD" stands for. "Water displacer, 40th version." The last thing you want to do use an air gun. You are lucky your gun is not big or powerful enough to break off the studs. It would usually take an 3/4" gun to do that unless you've got a high performace IR gun with a 2-stage compressor and 140 PSI. Use heat. That and a 6 point socket. If you don't have metric, 15/16" lor 7/8" is fine (I forget which). A hand-held propane torch might give enough heat but I use oxy-acet. A few seconds on each nut and they come right off. You need a big tire iron - or just spend $30 and buy a cheap 3/4" rachet and socket set from Harbor Freight. I use a 3/4 rachet on all my truck wheels. Makes it easier and give good control to remove stuck nuts. Note that if you have a 3/4" rachet, you can buy a 3/4" to 1/2" adapter and use 1/2" sockets on it if wanted. Comes in handy when working with many big and tight bolts and nuts. 1 ton lugs that are stuck, rear-axle pinion nut, etc. You can buy a 3/4" rachet for $20. Not long ago the entire kit with rachet, breaker bar,and sockets sold for $20 but things have gone up in China. If you ever do get one, do not buy a cheap 3/4" to 1/2" adapter. Buy one that is name brand since the cheap ones break easy. http://www.harborfreight.com/34-jumbo-ratchet-68110.html A few years ago my 1985 Toyota was due for NY motor-vehicle inpection. The inspector has to take off a wheel for it. Before I went for inspection I took off my wheels by hand and had to use a little heat (NY rust). I did that to make sure some idiot with a high power air gun did not break off the lugs. Guess what? The guy broke off three lugs and then the shop tried to charge me for the repair. And I had just had them all off an hour before! When they found out I was a mechanic and also had just had them off - they paid for the whole deal. What a rip off though. I also had that happen many times with my 1969 Dodge Powerwagon truck with left-hand nuts. Just keep in mind that lug nuts if they've been stuck need to come off slow. They get real hot and will snap off if turned too fast. With a big hand-held wrench you can feel when it gets to a yield point. Do not ever use your air gun on the front either. A powerful gun will warp disk brake rotors. A good repair shop will never used one (yet most do). A good shop will have torque-wrenches for lug nuts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek up North Posted February 7, 2013 Share Posted February 7, 2013 Do NOT use/abuse a torque wrench by using it to remove your wheels. As far as I know, the only time you'll come across LH threads is with an axle with the 6 hand holes which I believe is 1986 specific. Tightening torque(s). The 1993 FSM lists 170 ft-lb. The 1988 FSM lists 141 ft-lb. No idea when and why it changed so I'm not really sure which of the 2 to suggest! Will a 1988 axle (and studs) safely take 170 ft-lbs? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek up North Posted February 7, 2013 Share Posted February 7, 2013 Counter-clockwise to tighten for LH threads. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zero Posted February 8, 2013 Share Posted February 8, 2013 Do NOT use/abuse a torque wrench by using it to remove your wheels. As far as I know, the only time you'll come across LH threads is with an axle with the 6 hand holes which I believe is 1986 specific. Tightening torque(s). The 1993 FSM lists 170 ft-lb. The 1988 FSM lists 141 ft-lb. No idea when and why it changed so I'm not really sure which of the 2 to suggest! Will a 1988 axle (and studs) safely take 170 ft-lbs? There is something wrong there. Misprint? My Toyota dually truck has 14 mm studs - basically the same as a 1/2" stud. SAE grade 8 or metric grade 10.9. Max torque would usually be 120-130 foot pounds and that's pushing it (for any other truck stud that size). Even if they were some sort of special grade e.g. 12.9 studs (which I doubt) max would be 160 foot lbs. I know I cannot buy 12.9 through normal channels. A standard 14 mm torque-limiting wrench like a tire shop would have probably stops at 100 lbs for a 14 mm or 1/2" wheel stud. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek up North Posted February 8, 2013 Share Posted February 8, 2013 There is something wrong there. Misprint? http://personal.utulsa.edu/~nathan-buchanan/93fsm/suspensionandaxle/34reara.pdf Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zero Posted February 8, 2013 Share Posted February 8, 2013 http://personal.utulsa.edu/~nathan-buchanan/93fsm/suspensionandaxle/34reara.pdf I see it but I don't believe it. It defies the laws of hardware (in my opinion) unless Toyota is using something close to Kryptonite. A 1/2" bolt can only be made just so strong. Max torque for a grade 8, 1/2" bolt or wheel-stud. . . or a metric grade 10.9, 14 mm bolt or wheel stud is 120 lbs with a little leeway (dry, oil lubed, etc.). My 1 ton Dodge diesel truck has the same size studs as the Toyota and Dodge wheel-nut torque specs are - 95 foot lbs. with nuts that have a 60 degree cone, and 100 foot pounds if the nuts have 90 degree cones. My Ford Super-duty F250 diesel with bigger 9/16" studs calls for 150 foot pounds of torque (bigger then what my Toyota dually 1 ton has). My hardware chart shows max torque on a 14 mm X 1.5 stud as . . 130 lbs. max for a grade 10.9 and 155 lbs. for a grade 12.9. I don't find specs on what Toyota uses OEM but I know new replacement studs are grade 10.9. The studs on the front and back of the 1987 Toyota 1 ton box truck I've got here are marked on the back 10.9. I can't figure how Toyota calls for more unless maybe some newer 1 ton axles have bigger studs? My Toyota 1 ton dually is a 1987 and all the studs are 14 mm. Nuts take a 7/8" or 15/16" (23 mm) wrench. I can't account for the specs in the Toyota book but for myself -I'd never try to crank them up to 170 foot pounds - at least not for 14 mm studs and nuts. Not unless I found an explanation somethere that makes sense. 10 years ago GM put a bogus torque spec in the their factory tech manual that caused a lot of ruined wheel bearings. It happens. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek up North Posted February 8, 2013 Share Posted February 8, 2013 As I said, the '88 FSM calls for 141 ft-lb. My '92 Owners Manual also repeats the 170 ft-lb. (pg 200). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stevo Posted February 8, 2013 Share Posted February 8, 2013 I jacked up the donor Sunrader today (the 21'er). I found a cool lug nut wrench at Walmart for $16 and an awesome little blow torch at Harbor Freight with an electric starter for only $15. Torching a lug nut for about 5 seconds made those nuts come right off! Seriously, where have I been all my life without a freaking blow torch?! The blocks are 6 X 8's which means two blocks stacked on top of each other is net about 10 1/2" tall plus the height of the 6 ton jack stands. The front stands are 14" in front of the front brackets and are at their lowest setting. The rear stands are 16" aft of the rear brackets and one is at its lowest setting and the other is set to its first click to keep the motorhome level. The bottom of the differential is at least 12" off the ground. Here are my questions please... 1) Based on everything I told you previously, is that high enough to work on? The back tires are about 3" off the ground. It looks like its high enough to me but what do I know?? 2) With one more set of supports behind the current rear jack stands, would you feel safe working under this? 3) I may not have enough big wood to stack for the third row of supports. If I don't, would it be safe enough if I added two more 6 ton jack stands behind the rear jack stands? That would mean there would be 6 one ton jack stand supporting each motorhome. What do you think? 4) You will notice that I used the same 6 X 8 blocks to make 45 degree angle wedges for the front wheels. Is that good enough or do you think I should staple some 2 X material between the front and back wedges? 5) Does heat work to loosen rusty stuff too? I am open to any suggestions you might have because going under there does kinda freak me out and I want it to be as secure as possible. Thanks again guys! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zero Posted February 8, 2013 Share Posted February 8, 2013 Having enough room depends on you and how tight you are willing to work. I like having some room to move around while under a rig and not be flat on my back all the time. The rear itself would come out with the bottoms of the leaf springs touching the ground as long as there was no weight on them. They must be unladen and fully expanded if you want an assembled rear axle to fit through with the brake backing plates attached. As to heat and rust? I live in a place where salt is used winter and summer and I suspect 3/4s of all repairs I do related to rust damage. Here - bolts and nuts would never come out with heat. The American stuff is somewhat better then the Japanese. The Japanese hardware on Toyotas and Hondas breaks easier. Lower grade steel I assume or more prone to rust damage. A nut rusted fast on a stud can be heated cherry red with an oxy-acet torch and will then usually spin right off without breakage as long as it's plain steel. if it's a brass or stainless-steel nut on a steel stud - the heat won't help. A bolt that's stuck in a casting is more difficult since the heat needs to be applied around the bolt and not the bolt itself. Heat expands metal and cold contracts it. If something is real stuck -usually getting it near orange hot and then hitting it with cold water will shock it loose. I use heat when removing rusty U-joints also. Driveshaft ears bend very easy so pressing without heat can do damage if not done with proper back-up. Usually if you take a drive-shaft and heat up all the areas where caps are - and then stick in a cold bucket of water - it will come apart MUCH easier. I just got done stripping an extremely rusty 1987 1 ton Toyota. Biggest problem was the bolt heads had rusted off so bad no wrench would fit them. I still got them out with heat and Vise-grips and a few other tricks. On a vehicle that has not seen salt - often a small propane torch is enough to expand stuck hardware and shock it loose. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek up North Posted February 8, 2013 Share Posted February 8, 2013 Rusted fasteners ---> The Blue Wrench!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zero Posted February 8, 2013 Share Posted February 8, 2013 Rusted fasteners ---> The Blue Wrench!! On that 87 1 ton box truck I stripped - I wanted to use my "blue wrench" to get the gas tank out - but I chickened out. The heads of the bolts that hold the tank in are just about completely gone and no way will any socket turn them. I was in the middle of a car gas tank fire when I was a kid and torching near fuel tanks now scares me a little. I later found a hole in the bottom of the tank anyway so no big loss. I took the sending unit and pump out the top and the rest can go to scrap. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek up North Posted February 8, 2013 Share Posted February 8, 2013 Don't know if it would have worked on your tank nut, but I've got one of these that might have done the job: http://www.walmart.com/ip/Gator-Grip-3pc-Universal-Socket-Set/16504600 Though I don't usually have much faith in things "As seen on TV", I picked one up at a garage sale for a couple of bucks. I've actually found uses for it a couple of times. Locking lug nuts? No problem any more if you've lost the 'key'. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stevo Posted February 9, 2013 Share Posted February 9, 2013 (edited) Thanks for your answers and I will ask these two questions again please...1) Do you think it will be safe enough to work under if I added two more 6 ton jack stands in the back instead of a pile of wood (cuz I doubt I will have enough wood) so there will be a total of six 6 ton jack stands supporting each motorhome?2) You will see in the photo on my previous post (#53) that I made wedges out of 6 X 8's for the front wheels. Do you think that is secure enough to keep the front from rolling?P.S. I had never heard the term "blue wrench" before but this is what I used and it was amazing! http://www.harborfreight.com/electric-start-propane-torch-91061.html Edited February 9, 2013 by Stevo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stevo Posted April 8, 2013 Share Posted April 8, 2013 Work and other stuff (including Pep Boys kept ordering the wrong bushings 3 times and a hive of very aggressive bee's that took up residence next to my RV!) has kept me from being able to work on my axle swap but I was up there today and have some questions for anyone that can answer them please... 1) Do I need to take the wheel apart to remove the parking brake cable from the wheel? If so, how difficult of a job is that? 2) I assume the parking brake cables stay on the vehicles that they are on now? Any problems hooking up my keeper Sunraders parking brake cable to its new 1 ton wheels? 3) To remove the bolts from the brackets where the rear suspension attaches to the frame, should I cover the threaded ends of the bolts with a piece of wood and whack it with a hammer? Thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zero Posted April 8, 2013 Share Posted April 8, 2013 The parking brake cables are held on by two small bolts (10 mm hex head) and the bulb at the end of the cable that threads into the swing-arm on a brake shoe. Yes, the wheels and drums must come off to remove IF you want to disconnect at the axle. If you choose to disconnect from the other end - then no dissassembly is needed. On my 1978 Chinook - the original parking brake cables fit the 1987 dually full-floater just fine. No mods needed. With your setup - I don't know if your parking brake setups are identical on both trucks. If they are both the same with the same length front cables - then maybe you can just unhook the cables with they join the front cable. If not, you'll need to unhook at the end-housing behind the brake drums. In regard to the bolts on the rear suspension? For the spring perches or for the stabilizer link mounts?? If you're worried about thread damage - thread a nut onto the bolt and screw it on so it's just flush with the end. Then put a large driver on it and wack with a hammer to shock it loose. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sunrading Arkansas Posted April 8, 2013 Author Share Posted April 8, 2013 My E-brake cables were out of a 21fter for my 18ft, I simply adjusted the E-brake mechanism (mid-chassis) and took a small amount of slack out with a tiny cable clamp (holding both left&right brake cable together at an equal point).....to put it simply the differance in length wasn't that much...maybe 3-5inches. And I was too lazy to pull the brake lines out of the old axle before I traded it for my 1-ton, so I had no other option than to improv. Just a quick update: I've racked up 300miles on my set-up fully loaded (some of which - appx. 40 miles - down rough gravel roads, and with some water in all tanks for short distances). So far my bolt-in upper shock mounts appear to be holding their own. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stevo Posted April 8, 2013 Share Posted April 8, 2013 Congratulations on your first 300 miles and especially with your unconventional shock mounts! :-) When I follow the parking brake cable back on each side (after it breaks into a 'Y') it threads through a bracket that seems to be permanently mounted to the frame and I don't see any connections or nuts or anything at that point that will allow me to remove it (I'm not referring to the two easily removed bolt-on brackets that follow the much larger bracket just mentioned). I also thought I could remove it at the cable clamps (after the 'Y') and move it over to the keeper Sunrader, but again, it appears that all the connections that follow are permanent which means it can't be unthreaded through that bracket Bottom line: It looks to my non-mechanic eye that the only way to disconnect it is from inside the wheel. What am I missing here? Can it be taken apart at the cable clamps and threaded through that bracket...or can I disconnect it at that bracket? If I have to remove it from inside the wheel, how difficult of a job is that for the 1/2 ton and 1 ton? And if I remove it at the wheel, will the cable fitting at the wheel of the 18' keeper Sunrader fit the "new" wheel of the 1 ton? RE: Removal of bolts. I was referring to the bolts on the brackets where the leaf springs mount. The 21' donor Sunrader (with the 1 ton axle) doesn't have a stabilizer but I think I recall the 18' keeper Sunrader does. Thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sunrading Arkansas Posted April 9, 2013 Author Share Posted April 9, 2013 @Stevo - There are thin metal U-clips that hold the break lines in those welded (for lack of a better word) ports. I had to pull mine out with a pair of pliers (watch the knuckles) before I could pull the break cables through....as to your other question, I can't help but for me it was easier to swap everything as assembled as possible. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zero Posted April 9, 2013 Share Posted April 9, 2013 If I have to remove it from inside the wheel, how difficult of a job is that for the 1/2 ton and 1 ton? And if I remove it at the wheel, will the cable fitting at the wheel of the 18' keeper Sunrader fit the "new" wheel of the 1 ton? When I put the 1987 dually full floater into my 1978 Chinook with the "1/2 ton" rear - I disconnected the 1978 cables AT the wheel area on each side. Then after the dually " 1 ton" was bolted in place, I hooked up those original cables to the bigger axle. No problem and all fit fine. The brake drums on either MUST be off to get the cables unooked. Two little bolts hold the cable housing to the brake backing plate. The end of the cable itself has a knob that threads into a steel swing-arm attached to a brake shoe. Taking the drums off the 1/2 ton axle is easy. They slip right off without removing the axles. Not so easy with the dually FF rear. But - if you are installing that rear it seems you'd want to pull it apart anyway to make sure the bearings are greased and brakes are OK. That would be standard routine in my shop. You have to pull the hub end caps off which means removing the little nuts and knocking loose those tiny little self-expanding cone washers. Then pull the axles out. Then take the bearing adjuster hardware off and remove the drums/hubs and wheel bearings. Toyota did not provide the luxury of having drums that slide off the bearing hubs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stevo Posted April 10, 2013 Share Posted April 10, 2013 JD - I realize doing the bearings and brake work now would be the most convenient but I've never done brake work nor have I done an axle swap either. I might have a mechanic fiddle with the brakes and bearings after the swap. I dunno. If I can find a video that shows super simple instructions for how a 10 year old can grease bearings and do brakes on a 1 ton Toyota axle then maybe I'll do that stuff myself. I'd like to learn just so I'll know how to in the future and won't have to rely on others to do the work though. We shall see... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stevo Posted April 10, 2013 Share Posted April 10, 2013 Are those "thin metal U-clips" located on each side of the welded bracket? It was a little dark under there on Sunday so I'll get a flash light under there next time but is it obvious the way those U-clips come off? Do they pull away from each side of the bracket that the parking brake cable feeds through? @Stevo - There are thin metal U-clips that hold the break lines in those welded (for lack of a better word) ports. I had to pull mine out with a pair of pliers (watch the knuckles) before I could pull the break cables through....as to your other question, I can't help but for me it was easier to swap everything as assembled as possible. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zero Posted April 10, 2013 Share Posted April 10, 2013 JD - I realize doing the bearings and brake work now would be the most convenient but I've never done brake work nor have I done an axle swap either. I might have a mechanic fiddle with the brakes and bearings after the swap. I dunno. If I can find a video that shows super simple instructions for how a 10 year old can grease bearings and do brakes on a 1 ton Toyota axle then maybe I'll do that stuff myself. I'd like to learn just so I'll know how to in the future and won't have to rely on others to do the work though. We shall see... I understand but . . . both your axles have sealed bearings. I.e., they get no lube "refreshment" from the oil reservoir. So, every X amount of miles the 1/2 ton bearings need to be replaced and the FF bearings need to be repacked with grease. it's a case of doing it now as preventative maintenance or possible doing it later after a breakdown on the road somewhere. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sunrading Arkansas Posted April 10, 2013 Author Share Posted April 10, 2013 You'll see the U-clips once you get under it with some light, it's pretty straight forward once you find them. As to the bearings & seals, if you truely aren't comfortable doing them yourself I think you'd be fine to make it to a shop immediately after the swap. It is a pretty simple job IF you're willing to get greasy - HOWEVER, the part you need to be "knowledgable" about is how to check the bearings/axle-shafts for pitting/hair-line cracks/etc...they must be very clean to find these imperfections (which I have found on NEW bearings as well, so even those aren't exempt)...otherwise it could be repacked, resealed, etc. all for naught. just my $.02. Like JD, I think either way it should be done ASAP. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stevo Posted April 25, 2013 Share Posted April 25, 2013 More questions por favor... 1) There is no place to disconnect my parking cables on both of my Sunraders anywhere which means cutting it now and replacing it with a new cable later (which is what I resorted to on the donor Sunrader) or disconnect it at the wheels. Sorry if you already mentioned this, but did you disconnect the parking brake cable at the wheels of your Sunrader or did yours have a section elsewhere on the cable where you could disconnect it? And does the parking brake cable where it attaches to the 1/2 ton wheels fit perfectly on the 1 ton wheels without modification? 2) My keeper Sunrader is the 18'er with the little bathroom straight forward when you open the side door. Is your 18'er configured like that too? I'm asking because the black water holding tank on my 18'er for the shower/toilet is in the way of me being able to remove the bolt from the front bracket where the leaf springs attach. There are two steel straps holding the black water tank to the floor of the Sunrader and when I try to remove the two nuts that hold the steel straps they spin which means I cut the straps or tear out the bathroom now to get to the bolts that hold the straps. What did you do? I'm going to be tearing that bathroom out anyway but would rather do it after the axle is done than now. What did you do? Are those steel straps/bands difficult to replace? Where do you buy something like that? If they are easy to replace then I'll just cut em now and deal with the inside demo later. 3) Is there anything I should know when I connect the differential to its new 1 ton axle? Do I need a torque wrench to tighten those nuts? 4) The 1/2 ton axle has a sway bar (at least I think thats what its called) and the 1 ton does not. Assuming it will fit, should I put the sway bar from the 1/2 ton axle on the 1 ton axle? 5) The shocks from the 1 ton (the donor) are Monroe with airbags and the shocks from the keeper are some blue shocks with no name on them. Both vehicles have about 60,000 miles on them. I have no idea if they are still any good, but would it be worthwhile to move the Monroes with airbags over to the keeper motorhome? Thanks Steve Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sunrading Arkansas Posted April 29, 2013 Author Share Posted April 29, 2013 1) I assure you there is a place to disconnect to e-break cables (at least on the 18er) - it's behind the trans in the center of the vehicle. This was the same on the 21fter I got my axle from. I didn't mess with it at the wheels, if you follow them at the wheels forward you'll hit a junction - that's where they disconnect. 2) I addressed this in post #8 in this thread 3) It goes in the same way it comes out, I didn't torque mine but I did tighten them very tight with a rachet 4) Up to you, I would have had to buy new mounting hardware to use my old sway bar and I didn't feel it was neccessary with the increased number of springs and new shocks...but I kept it in case I change my mind. 5) Can't comment on this one, but I'd recommend new vs. old. I can say that I would like to install airbags at some point, so if I had them I'd use them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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