Jump to content

Recommended Posts

First V8 showed up in a Lexus in 89 then later in a Tundra pretty close to the introduction of a V6 pickup in 88.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 8 months later...
  • Replies 208
  • Created
  • Last Reply

Top Posters In This Topic

Has anyone cosidered turboing the stock efi setup to around 5lbs? Other toyota truck guys say it can be done. Seen some builds on forums. I wonder if this would help the dolphin up huge grades.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 2 weeks later...

Maxpow99, I just found your post!  I can defiantly answer questions like this one!!!      

5psi is a numbest that isn't going to really do a whole lot.  It will pep up the motor some, but probably not add much more than 30-40hp to it.  This is enough to make a difference, and actually probably enough to get it to the stock level of the 6cly motors.  But why would you stop there?

The only reason to limit to 5psi, is the limitations of the stock EFI system to begin with.  It has three major roadblocks to performance.  The fuel injector size, the air flapper vane meter, and its lack of tuneability.  Sticking with the stock engine management will require dealing with these.  While you MIGHT be able to get a safe setup using them, it is a VERY BIG MIGHT.

Are you going to trust your motor to this?  I wouldn't.  Here are the issues.

For boost you will have to increase the amount of fuel flow to the injectors.  In a tunable system this is easily accomplished by telling them to squirt more fuel.  But the stock fuel injectors don't have enough flow, so you have to increase the fuel pressure.  Doing this requires a rising rate fuel pressure regulator.  There is no real tuneability to it, it just increases the fuel pressure and randomly dumps more fuel in boost.  The pressures usally can be tweaked, but it is hit and miss.  

The stock ECU also has no way to increase the time on the injectors.  And at a certain undetermined point, the air meter flapper is already wide open.  So beyond that point the engine has no idea that the air flow is increasing.  Not to mention plumbing up that flapper valve into the boost pipes/intake system is a big enough pain that I don't know of any manufactures that used it.  They (mostly) all went to MAP (manifold air pressure) based sensors to accomplish this easily.  Back in the 90's and early 00's, there were black boxes out there that could do this conversion.  The only ones you might still be able to find are/were made by Apexi.  And not easily tuned.  They would suit an old vintage Toyota build well, but they also only handle fuel.  

Here is the big secret most tuners either don't know, or won't tell you.  80% or more of the power is not in fuel, it is in tuning the spark.  80% or more of economy tuning, is in the fueling.  Without the ability to tune both, you are just blowing gas dangerously out the tailpipe and refilling the tank with your wallet.  

In boost, you also have to pull out some timing for safety.     

I would never attempt any of this with a factory EFI setup. Now the 22RE itself (and its 6cyl brothers) are more than happy to take boost.  I have tuned a couple (in cars) to double the HP on boost with no internal engine changes.  The 22RE can defiantly handle the power jump.  A worn out one (if it is even possible to do so) probably would need a freshen up.  Rings and bearings.  If I had the head apart I would try to put in a cam with no overlap for better economy in boost, but not really necessary.  

150-175hp with 15-18psi should be easily and safety doable.  I think that is reachable on 10-15psi even.  Above 175hp though and you will need to look at the supporting components.  Transmission, driveshaft, etc.  Chances are on our Yotas here they are going to handle it fine.  But usally when you close in on doubling the stock HP is where you are looking at engine internals and supporting components.   

So cost and how?  Well the turbo parts are going to to be pretty set in the base price.  Manifolds are on eBay for $200.  A $99 adapter is needed to run a standard T3 (or t3t04e) turbo.  Cheap turbos can be had for $100-200.  Piping and couplers about $100.  Intercooler, $50-150.  Roughly $600.  Rear exhaust piping will need to be upgraded to probably 2.5."  Can't put a price on that really as it is simple parts, but not simple access.  

And still, you need the engine management.  Cobbling together junk to make it work could cost any random "wheel of fortune" spin.  $500, 1000, or bankrupt LOL!  

To do it right...

Fuel delivery should be up to the task, but I would still put a quality fuel pump in, say a nice new Bosch.  We won't count this, basic maintenance really.  

A MegaSquirt is the only engine management choice I would make, but I am biased and have installed well over 100 of them.  Other choices are out there, but their cost is dramatically higher.  MegaSquirt has more than enough advanced features and even its simplest system can easily handle this task.  There is even a Plug and Play ECU for our setup!  Although I don't think the price tag is worth it.  But it does plug right into the stock wiring.  The cheapest option they have, a MS1 v2.2, works on our setup using the stock Toyota ignitor.  That, a wiring kit, maybe a relay box, and sensors and you could still come in a little cheaper than the plug and play option.  

Oh to run the V2.2 ECUs, the low impedance injectors should be swapped out for some hi-z ones.  The stock injectors need to be upgraded for higher flowing ones anyways.  These days a set of new injectors can be had off eBay for $50, if not cheaper.    

The best part though is that for the 22RE engine, the install and ignition information is pretty well documented.  I didn't look, but I am pretty sure there are some decent base maps out there for it too.   This week I am focused on the basics and just gettign my new Toy to even ground.  But sometime soon I have at least one MegaSquirt taking up shelf space that is pretty likely to find its way into mine.  

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 6 months later...

lotta chatter and some silly arguments in this thread (what was up at that stamar guy?) but i only saw 3 successful swaps posted, all 3.0 -> 3.4

I know ive seen an older Sunrader 4x4 with a 350 chevy in it, but thats about the only 22RE swap ive seen, has anyone else taken the plunge on the 4cylinders?

Edited by defrag4
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Have not heard of or seen any 4cyl to 6cyl done on a Toyota motorhome but it's been done on the 4Runners.

Here is one example.

https://www.yotatech.com/forums/f160/22r-5vz-swap-126413/

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 1 month later...
On 1/22/2020 at 5:49 AM, ednelson100 said:

Have not heard of or seen any 4cyl to 6cyl done on a Toyota motorhome but it's been done on the 4Runners.

Here is one example.

https://www.yotatech.com/forums/f160/22r-5vz-swap-126413/

 

ya ive seen it done on the 4runners/pickups as well, just not on a yoterhome

 

hows the ol gal running Ed?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Running great James,

  I just hit 200,000 miles on the 3.4 motor and compression on all cylinders is 170 to 195. Just about the same as when I installed it 2 years ago when it already had 150K.

No major issues, but I did have to install a motor start relay to resolve the occasional only click when turning key to start.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 4 months later...

Hi everyone, great forum.  I have a 1975 Toyota Chinook with a swapped in Buick 3.8 litre (231 c.i.) V6 and GM 5 speed manual transmission with headers.  Lots of power

 and torque.  I can go up the steep mountain grades in British Columbia in 5th gear and not lose any speed.  The headers had to be cut and welded a bit to fit.  The motor mounts were custom made.  The drive shaft was shortened and balanced.

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

13 hours ago, Glenski said:

Hi everyone, great forum.  I have a 1975 Toyota Chinook with a swapped in Buick 3.8 litre (231 c.i.) V6 and GM 5 speed manual transmission with headers.  Lots of power

 and torque.  I can go up the steep mountain grades in British Columbia in 5th gear and not lose any speed.  The headers had to be cut and welded a bit to fit.  The motor mounts were custom made.  The drive shaft was shortened and balanced.

 

I think we need to see a picture of that. Sounds super fun though. 

Linda S

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Yes, it is a super fun little pop-up motor home.  I have had it for over 20 years. I will post some pictures in the next day or two.  I have the front grill off to install some fog lights and day running lights.  I will take a picture of the self-made motor mounts as well.  I forgot to note that the fan from the V6 engine does not fit.  I purchased a 17" vinyl racing fan from the US with a 1/2" spacer so the fan would not hit the engine.  I also put a larger radiator in from an Isuzu truck.  I had to install different radiator mounts as well, I think from a Toyota Camry. I also changed the tires.  The front aluminum rims are from an Olds Cutlass I think and the rear aluminum rims from an Ford sedan I think.  

Link to comment
Share on other sites

8 hours ago, Glenski said:

The front aluminum rims are from an Olds Cutlass I think and the rear aluminum rims from an Ford sedan I think.  

 

Since you've got a Hot Rod, maybe do the wheels too. 2006 Mustang GT. :)

 

Then swap in a GN engine and head for Bonneville :)

 

 

 

205 50 17   235 45 17   2006 Mustang GT 2.jpg

Link to comment
Share on other sites

17 hours ago, Derek up North said:

 

Since you've got a Hot Rod, maybe do the wheels too. 2006 Mustang GT. :)

 

Then swap in a GN engine and head for Bonneville :)

 

 

 

205 50 17   235 45 17   2006 Mustang GT 2.jpg

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Nice wheels.  I didn't think that Ford rims would fit on a Toyota!  Anyway, if you can find me a GN engine with a turbo of course I will gladly buy it and swap it in.  In the meantime I have an 1987 Olds Cutlass 3.8 litre V6 that I am going to rebuild to about 400 horsepower this winter and then swap in.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 9 months later...

Yes. It's in my friend Dave's Sunrader. The most ricked out Sunrader I know of. Has a Ford rear end and most of the chassis has been wrapped with steel to reinforce it. I can't even remember all the things he told me he did to it. 

Linda S

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 2 years later...

Hi folks. Spent some time scrolling through this threat but life is short. So, I will jump the line and ask my question.

I have a 1983 shorty Sunrader with 22r and a 4spd manual. 

The rest axle is out of an 87 and has a 4:88 rear end. I would like to swop in a 5spd. What are the options beyond the L52? What years of 4Runners would have comparable transmissions? The more options I have (years/vehicles) the more likely I can find one locally. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Same drive train here and also considering a 5 speed swap, so we'll kill two birds with one stone on the replies. Thanks!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

This question has gone unanswered for a bit as there is such a broad range that it is kinda hard for a simple "here is a list" kinda deal.  First off good luck finding 4Runners of that vintage cheaply.  But good news is the desirable ones are all 4wd and you need 2wd.  

 

A google search does bring up a LOT of information.  Just look for anything fitting the criteria, and not for RV specific.  You have a 1982 or 1983 2wd Toyota Pickup.     

 

If you are looking for a little extra power, consider exhaust and header upgrades before transmission swap.  I (personally) wouldn't bother with the swap, unless you have a failed 4spd.  

Edited by thewanderlustking
Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 1 month later...
On 2/5/2017 at 3:35 PM, RVdaytrader said:

Here is a place that does the swap start to finish. If closer to me I think I would do it. This is their email reply if they knew of a place closer to Durango that did the swap.

RE: 3.0L to 3.4L swap
 
C
cliff@toyonlyswaps.com
 
app-icon.png
 
boomerang_64_blue.png
 
wl_icon_standalone.png
 
 
 
Reply|
Mon 1/30, 11:24 AM
 
  No sir I do not, however we have customers from all over the country as far away as South Carolina, you may consider transport a option, it could save you money in the long run, and could save some heart ache knowing your Toyota is in good hands. We can drop you off or pick you up at the Eugene Airport if needed, Thanks, Below is our quote sheet take a look and let me know what you think . 
3.4 swap 88-95 3.0 V6 manual trans. 
    Complete 3.4 swap/conversion,  parts and labor including engine $4500 Base price If you are automatic add $500 in most cases. This is a start to finish 100% completed conversion ready for pickup,  We have customers from all over the world, we can accept transport of your vehicle or arrange to drop you off/pick you up at the Airport/Train/bus station business hours.

This is an old post from 7 years ago, but these folks are still in business and doing the swaps.  Prices, of course, have changed, so here's some updated info for reference.  Base price now (for RV) is $8500.  In my case, with all the "recommended" options such as timing belt, and some necessary modifications, the price was about $12000 with the basic used 3.4 engine.

 

My 3.0 had a probable burnt valve (weak cylinder) and I was thinking of going for this...they're about 700 miles north of us so it was drivable there as-is.  Then I got to rethinking it...the 3.0, if fixed, would likely be good for another 50k miles or so, way more than we'll need (we're both in mid-70's now and just RV-travel occasionally.

 

Added to that is that we're in CA, so the smog requirements demand a lot of extra trouble to get it approved.  And, the hood either has to be cut out for a scoop, or a special manifold used.  And apparently the steering gear interferes and needs to be swapped.  Thinking of the potential headaches of such a major operation, with them 700 miles away in case something isn't right, and dealing with smog referees etc., I just decided it wasn't worth it, so am going for fixing the 3.0 vz-e.  It's ready for a timing belt anyway, so might as well just get it running properly and be done with it.  Neither the full engine swap nor doing the heads/valves on the 3.0 can fully guarantee a trouble-free future and no hassles, and fixing the 3.0 is a lot cheaper.

 

But back to ToyOnlySwaps, they seem to have good reviews and definitely know their stuff.  It's now justin@toyonlyswaps.com, not Cliff.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Again, thanks for the responses and advise. Overall, I am not looking for more power.  I AM looking to reduce my RPMs at highway speeds. Current set up has lots of pep (for a toyhome:) and handles hills well. I've had it in 13 percent grades out west and 3rd gear was perfect on the Skyline Drive in the east. However, at 65 mph its RPMS are high and my mileage is barely into double digits. And, just in normal driving, it feels like it wants fifth. Not really liking to go faster. Just easier.

Even though it's 40 years old, the compression is still 180 psi in 3 cylinders and 177 in the fourth so it's still strong. We're set for another 6000+ mile trip this June. Would be nice to cruise along in fifth - if only downwind or down hill.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Idahodoug. We're headed west to Denver and then into Idaho through to Portland and on to the Pacific coast. In Idaho, probably Hwy 20 or 26,  after a quick stop in Wyoming at Jackson and Yellowstone. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

so a swap to a 5 speed would work for you

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Seems like a 5 speed would indeed be the ticket, Akwcanoe.  You've got the right ratio in the differential to meet your needs, just need a taller top gear.  If you've been watching my build thread, you'll know I will likely end up 300lbs heavier than stock, so I may need a 5 speed as well.

 

So the trip across Idaho - what month?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Idahodoug. We'll be rollin' through around the middle of June. Route is still TBD, as are dates based on weather, scenery, craft beers, etc. Will check out your thread. I am trying to reduce weight on my renos while upgrading/repairing. The full 1 ton conversion definately added weight. With half tanks and packed for a short trip, we are at 5800 on a 18ft Sunrader. Add the cargo rack, extra water and fuel and we're likely over 6000. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Nice. Great time to be out West. Our 21 ft manual tranny with no supplies, empty tanks n missing settee cushions weighed 4920 for comparison. I hope to have our Sunrader finished in May.  If you come through N Idaho instead (out of your current route) reach out n stop for a sandwich on your way through!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Well this is a certified scale at the county dump.  The top receipt is the accurate one from the official scale on the way out of the facility and I had it signed and it's acceptable by the DOT.  The bottom one I asked the person on the way in to weigh it and she was kind of new.  So she missed the front axle weight.  However, you'll note the total weight on the unofficial scale at the dump agrees to within 40lbs (less than 1%) of the official scale on the way out.  And the rear axle was exactly the same to the pound.

 

Now keep in mind this was as empty as any Sunrader could POSSIBLY be.  Dry black/fresh/grey tanks, a quarter fuel, my manual tranny is lighter than autos, the dinette cushions and the sleeper mattress and sleeper's wood section were missing, it only has a single battery, no jack or tools, propane half full, plain roof vents, single occupant.  So I purposely weighed it to capture that super low weight which nobody will ever see on a 21 foot unless you spent hours emptying your vehicle of literally every item not bolted down.

 

I wanted the weight to see down to the pound how much my remodel adds to the Sunrader.  Anyhow, you'd be surprised how much the detritus of life can weigh if you went through your entire RV. 

 

image.jpeg.6f67bf13b777d14b9ac22555a952e19b.jpeg

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I wasn't questioning your weight.  Akwcanoe was the weight I thought sounded wrong. He posted a few years back his rig weighed 4400lbs. A full float axle is heavier but maybe a few hundred pounds,  not 1400

Linda S

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Ah, got it.  I will also try to get the weight difference of the two axles when I do my install.  I'd guess it will be less than 75 lbs. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I visited a CAT scale near us and was a bit shocked. Might go again, based on your collective experience.  Of course, I could be mis-remembering. The paperwork is in the RV which is currently in winter storage until March. I would think  that the 1ton conversion only added a couple of hundred pounds at most. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Versus Foolie, Dually should be slightly thicker housing, heavier hubs, and an extra set of bearings on each end is all. Same differential, and axle shafts just have different tips. Cant see hundreds of pounds difference there? The scale will tell, but I suspect the entire axle does not weigh "hundreds of pounds".

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.




×
×
  • Create New...