DMG Posted May 5, 2009 Share Posted May 5, 2009 My 84 rear suspension just about touches the rear tires after it is loaded. I have seven leaf springs per side but need to "lift" it up a bit. My question is should I install air bags, (dont know what they are just read about them here) or install air shocks. Thanks for your advise. By the way if it is air shocks what do I ask for at the auto parts? DMG Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iadoptedatoy Posted May 5, 2009 Share Posted May 5, 2009 Check this place out. It's where I bought air shocks for my toy. http://www.3tsrv.com/ Cathy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WME Posted May 5, 2009 Share Posted May 5, 2009 Air Bags!!!! Air shocks place the load on the lower shock mounts. The mounts will often fail in several years. They just weren't designed for that much load. Airbags place the load on the frame and axle Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gulfstream Greg Posted May 5, 2009 Share Posted May 5, 2009 I have been going through the same questions. Air bags can give you up to 5000 pounds extra capacity. Gabriel air shocks can give you up to 1000 pounds extra capacity. Gabriel shocks with coil over springs will give you 500 pounds extra capacity. We drag on everything we go over, driveway entrances to gas stations etc. I have opted for the air shocks. Under $80 as compared to the air bags which are $280 if you look around. Another option which I will probably also install is a set of helper springs or add a leaf. There are some progressive helper springs on the market. They won't raise the back above normal height when empty but will help keep it there when loaded. You really don't want to go above normal height, doing so changes the geometry of the front steering. Camber and toe-in angles are changed when you raise the rear. Steering can be affected. The same applies to having the rear lower than normal. Also the rear height on our trucks affect how much braking is applied to the rear wheels. There is a lever back there that reduces braking to the rear wheels. On standard pickups when you make a hard stop the nose tends to dive and the rear rise. The lever senses this and reduces rear braking so the rear wheels do not lock up. So again level is warranted. If you plan to have the rear 2 inches higher than normal all the time, alignment and the rear brake rod should be adjusted to compensate. Plus 1984 springs have probably sagged by now. You might even consider a complete spring replacement. A good spring shop will determine how much weight is on each wheel and build springs accordingly for each side. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gulfstream Greg Posted May 5, 2009 Share Posted May 5, 2009 Air Bags!!!! Air shocks place the load on the lower shock mounts. The mounts will often fail in several years. They just weren't designed for that much load.Airbags place the load on the frame and axle Hmmm very good point I did not think of. Maybe my shocks which are already on their way are not such a good idea. In my owners manual (Gulfstream Conquest) they advise against air bags stating that handling is affected towards the negative. That statement does not make sense to me though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tumolt Posted May 5, 2009 Share Posted May 5, 2009 I have Firestone Ride Rite on my 1980 Toyota Huntsman. I have to replace the bags (30 yrs old) and am putting new ones back in. I asked the differential specialist if air shocks would work and he told the the ride rite airbag system is much better. You can go to the following link to find a distributor in your area. http://www.fsip2.com/fsipdist/WTBlightduty_NA_USA.php Hope this gets you up and moving. Thanks, Matt Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChairmanMeow7 Posted May 5, 2009 Share Posted May 5, 2009 I just noticed this post. I normally don't check the suspension and engine threads as often as I check the "regular" posts. I just purchased (yesterday) a set of air bags on E-Bay for $249 with FREE shipping. They had 3 sets available so I assume they still have 2 left. I beleive the brand name was "Air Lift". Does anyone have any experience with these ? Are they a good brand ? (It says they have a lifetime warranty). Also , this bussiness that sells them (E-Bay name "ourdealsrock") sent me an E-Mail stating if I give them 5 star feedback on E-Bay they will knock 10% off my next order. They seem to have great feedback after hundreds (if not thousands) of feedbacks. They said if for any reason I can NOT give them 5 star feedback to call them or write them before posting feedback. They seem like a decent company to deal with..... You can look up " Toyota Micro Mini " on E-Bay and it should bring you to the item. I will try and post a link later..... I currently do NOT have air bags on my 86 Winnebago , but as most of you know the Winnies are proabably the heaviest of all the coaches for our Toys. I weighed mine , and I think I had a full fuel and water tanks , and I had gear in it. I beleive I was standing outside the cab at the time and it weighed in at a whopping 6800 Lbs. !! I am not certain what I had in it , but I think I will have it weighed again. I am a bit concerned as this seems like a LOT of weight for the Toy frame , too the point of being "overloaded". The rear springs are just a little bit saggy (not that bad , really). But , I do notice that it is not level at times , and thus opted for the air bags. I may even opt for the onboard compressor system at some point so I can adjust it whenever (or wherever) needed. How do I measure to make sure this is riding at it's ORIGINAL (designed) height ? After reading this post , I do NOT want to overfill the springs so it is riding above original height for the reasons mentioned in this post (handling and braking characteristics etc.)..... Also , had I known about how heavy these were AND if I had known about the Sunraders , I may have just waited to find a decent Sunrader. But , I paid $4800 for this Winnie with only 43,000 and it didn't need all that much work , so I jumped on it. (It was kind of an "impulse" buy as I was not really in the market for a camper at the time). But I have NO regrets what so ever !! I am having a blast with it in the 2 years I have owned it (and can't wait to take my 1st trip of the year) !! When I 1st brought it home my GF said "what do you want that thing for" ??? NOW , when I am in a little money pinch I "kid" my GF saying I am going to sell her. She says "Don't you dare , sell that boat of yours 1st" (I think she has been bitten by the "Toy bug"). LOL !!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gulfstream Greg Posted May 7, 2009 Share Posted May 7, 2009 I currently do NOT have air bags on my 86 Winnebago , but as most of you know the Winnies are proabably the heaviest of all the coaches for our Toys. I weighed mine , and I think I had a full fuel and water tanks , and I had gear in it. I beleive I was standing outside the cab at the time and it weighed in at a whopping 6800 Lbs. !! 1986 18 foot Sunrader 4x4, fully loaded came in at 6800 pounds plus. The 4x4 gear certainly adds some weight but it goes to show you the weight of even the small rigs. I really think many are over the 6800 pound weight and do not know it cause they are all guessing! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iadoptedatoy Posted May 7, 2009 Share Posted May 7, 2009 I misspoke................ My husband says we have air bags not air shocks. We did get them from http://www.3tsrv.com/ Cathy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChairmanMeow7 Posted May 8, 2009 Share Posted May 8, 2009 1986 18 foot Sunrader 4x4, fully loaded came in at 6800 pounds plus. The 4x4 gear certainly adds some weight but it goes to show you the weight of even the small rigs. I really think many are over the 6800 pound weight and do not know it cause they are all guessing! I stand corrected ! I heard (on here) that the Winnies were the heaviest.... When I saw what other owners had posted what theirs weighed , I was worried about a (serious) overloading problem. But 6800 Lbs. , this is still quite a bit more than our Toy chassis were designed to carry , is it not ? I was actually thinking of removing the original fridge , as it doesn't work (and hopefully lighten it up a little in the process). I was going to put a dorm fridge in and run it off an inverter. But now I am hearing (other threads on here) that may not be such a good idea because of battery drain. But , I am not usually diconnected from shore power for more than a day or so. And , I do have a 160 amp HD alternator which I installed and a generator (although I don't always bring it). This should help keep the coach battery charged (at least I hoped). And , I don't normally stay parked for more than a day anyways. Do you think I may be able to get away with a small dorm fridge in this instance , or is it still ill advised ? I use an ice chest for now and it seems to suit my needs (for the most part) , but it would be nice to have a working fridge for longer trips.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sparky60 Posted May 9, 2009 Share Posted May 9, 2009 Hi all. I too am intersested in a set of air bags for my 1983 Toy/ Dolphin. I checked a few of the links montioned here but its a bit confusing. The micro mino's on Ebay are listed for 1984 thru 1994 , so I guess there no help for me. The Firestone Ride Rite ones are listed for 1965 thru 1995 for Toyota PICK-UPS. ( Model 1130), but it dosen't say for RV's just pick-ups. So would these work for 84' Toy/Dolphin ? Also would you have to adjust the air pressure in them constantly or just when you install them ?.......thks... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Supurcar Posted May 9, 2009 Share Posted May 9, 2009 I have the air bags on mine, and Greg has a point about the rear height. I have about 40# in my air bags and it is a visible lift and my last set of tire where worn uneven. I also put in the Rancho 5000 shocks to help with the bumps, I guess these shocks have a larger piston so they handle the bumps. I do like the bags as it is easy to adjust, and they are very secure in their placement. Be careful where you run the air lines if you go this route, when I bought mine the air lines where melted. It seems the previous owner had run them over the exhaust, it looked like maybe the fastener fell of or something, but they where melted and the rear was dropping (but not touching the tires). I like the idea of the leaf helpers, and I wonder if there is a heavy duty sway bar or torsion bar available? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T.A.J. Posted May 9, 2009 Share Posted May 9, 2009 Good day. After much searching and even had my '84 Dolphin in a shop that installs air bags here in Butte Mt. for a day, they told me no air bags will work on this RV. I took it to a shop in Bozeman and had Timbrens installed. Awesome stability and ride. I had them mounted a quarter inch from the body. No maintenance and last for ever. $417.00 installed. www.timbrens.com Check them out. I highly recomend. T.A.J. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
futar Posted May 10, 2009 Share Posted May 10, 2009 I used the full length 2,000 # leaf boosters made by Superior Automotive http://www.amazon.com/Superior-11-1040-Hel...3981265-5232361 They cost about $38 and go right over the shackle. Many auto stores carry them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gulfstream Greg Posted May 11, 2009 Share Posted May 11, 2009 I used the full length 2,000 # leaf boosters made by Superior Automotive http://www.amazon.com/Superior-11-1040-Hel...3981265-5232361They cost about $38 and go right over the shackle. Many auto stores carry them. Those look like just I am looking for. Here is a better image of them. http://www.sup-auto.com/catalogs/rideeffex.pdf Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Supurcar Posted May 19, 2009 Share Posted May 19, 2009 I went to my local auto parts store and he had a listing for these same helpers. Although he wanted $80.00 for the set, I am wondering if these are sold individually or as a set of two? That might explain why they where charging double. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
futar Posted May 19, 2009 Share Posted May 19, 2009 Sounds like the parts store from oooo. Did you have to hold your hands in the air while they rifled your wallet? They're only sold as a set of two. There are some from Hellwig brand that are expensive, but that's not what we're talking about. Knechts here in Oregon wants $39.99. Autozone sometimes carries them. I'm sure others do. I went to my local auto parts store and he had a listing for these same helpers. Although he wanted $80.00 for the set, I am wondering if these are sold individually or as a set of two? That might explain why they where charging double. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T.A.J. Posted May 22, 2009 Share Posted May 22, 2009 TIMBRENS I SAY!!!! Anybody even looked? www.timbrens.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gulfstream Greg Posted May 22, 2009 Share Posted May 22, 2009 TIMBRENS I SAY!!!!Anybody even looked? www.timbrens.com That address does not work try this one http://www.truckspring.com/timbren_285.htm...WID=15430322021 I don't see that they are adjustable via pressure adjustment. I am not saying they will not do the job but for me I would prefer to fine tune for my needs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Supurcar Posted May 24, 2009 Share Posted May 24, 2009 I bought a cheap set of helpers because they where on the shelf, they looked like pot metal or something. One side was a u joint and the other bolted over the leaf spring. When the bolt snapped on installation (I really did not even tighten it that much) I figured I did not want to find out on the road that they where poorly constructed, if I can snap them without much effort I figure a good size pot hole would shatter the mess. I returned them the same day, I will buy a set that has two u joint ends next time. The Timbrens look interesting, I wonder how they compare to the bags? I guess they would not strengthen your leafs, just help when the failing leafs bottom out or start to droop. I have the bags now, but I am tied of the jacked up look, and my leafs seem to sag a little when the air pressure is low in the bags. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T.A.J. Posted May 24, 2009 Share Posted May 24, 2009 That address does not worktry this one http://www.truckspring.com/timbren_285.htm...WID=15430322021 I don't see that they are adjustable via pressure adjustment. I am not saying they will not do the job but for me I would prefer to fine tune for my needs. timbrens.com works fine here. They took all the sway and/or leaning on corners away. When I walk up the two steps into the Dolphin, stable. I really like the results I get from these simple little units. T.A.J. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gulfstream Greg Posted May 27, 2009 Share Posted May 27, 2009 Those look like just I am looking for. Here is a better image of them. http://www.sup-auto.com/catalogs/rideeffex.pdf OK, so I bought a pair from Amazon. BIG BAD NEWS though. Just too week for my application. I can deflect them almost flat just by standing on the spring. That's not good. Its really meant for a stock pickup and if it really gives 2000 pounds extra capacity I would be surprised. Besides that they will not fit my spring pack. I have 4 original and 4 added to the pack for a total of 8 leafs. The supplied U Bolts won't even make it past my spring pack so there is no way to bolt them up. Looks like they will bolt on a stock pickup spring pack. If they were as advertised I would find some U Bolts and install them but the fact that I can almost deflect the spring even with its ends is a joke. They should not even deflect in the slightest to give the 1000 pounds each they advertise. I am running right around 240 pounds. Amazon gets these back and they better pay shipping. Look for a product review in the product review section soon. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pandu Posted July 16, 2011 Share Posted July 16, 2011 (edited) The proper way to do it is through your existing suspension, meaning your springs are too soft and need to be replaced or repaired. I researched this in my area with several reputable people. My '84 Dolphin had springs that were 'enhanced' with 3 new leafs over time but were worn out nonetheless. Fixing them was $360, having new custom ones made was $680 which I opted for. Beautiful solid ride and no scraping from this baby anymore. The added benefit is that solid springs limit any 'sway' you get going around corners or on uneven ground. Edited July 16, 2011 by pandu Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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