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Suspension: sway bar prevents airbag installation


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I was hoping to install airbags on my Toyota Sunrader shorty, but it looks like there's a sway bar that'll prevent their installation. Has anyone solved this problem? Thanks!

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Can you flip the mounting brackets and mount the bar under the axle. Just some threadall and make the anchor rods longer

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On 4/4/2019 at 5:44 PM, linda s said:

Can you take a pic from underneath. I have a sway bar and air bags and they don't interfere at all. 

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Sorry it took so long to get this, Linda. Here are some more pictures.

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I see what you mean. Those clamps holding the sway bar exactly over your axle certainly aren't helping. They aren't stock. Your rig didn't come with a sway bar. Only the 4x4's had them so someone rigged up one to fit. My sway bar isn't stock either. The air bags don't need to be installed directly over the axle though. In front or back, you just need to find a place to locate them. In your case I think it's your helper springs getting in the way. 

Image result for firestone toyota air springs

Linda S

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just wondering what the 3 pieces of wood over the rear axle is used for ???

 

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19 minutes ago, Homer said:

just wondering what the 3 pieces of wood over the rear axle is used for ???

 

Maybe someone’s quick fix to a soft floor?

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Your sway bar mounts are some of the worst I've seen.

Here are what you need for a simple mount setup, its flexible enough to mount the bar on top the axle, behind the axle or under the axle. Important measurements are axle tube dia. and the sway bar dia and the width of the u-bolt.

You need 2 muffler clamps for your axle dia....https://www.summitracing.com/parts/sum-g4630-1/overview/

You need a set of these (2ea)...https://www.summitracing.com/parts/rnb-928-545/overview/

You may have enough stuff with your old brackets to just need the muffler clamp saddle.

Edited by WME
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That’s a crazy setup. Your ride must be really rough. My observations based on your picture. The angle brackets for the sway bar are resting against the bump stops. This means every time you hit a bump or pot hole instead of the leaf springs doing their job, all that force is directed  to the frame rails themselves. 

The wood was probably placed there to keep the sway bar from crashing up through the floor. Very Micky Mouse setup. Definitely needs to be changed. 

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18 hours ago, Odyssey 4x4 said:

Maybe someone’s quick fix to a soft floor?

Exactly! 🎯

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13 hours ago, fred heath said:

That’s a crazy setup. Your ride must be really rough. My observations based on your picture. The angle brackets for the sway bar are resting against the bump stops. This means every time you hit a bump or pot hole instead of the leaf springs doing their job, all that force is directed  to the frame rails themselves. 

 

The ride IS really rough, which is why I want to add air bags. 

However, I don't believe the sway bars are making contact with the bump stops. That's just an optical illusion due to the angle of the photographs. 

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38 minutes ago, fred heath said:

The wood was put there for a reason. It’s still a Micky Mouse setup. 

If the swap bar was hitting the wood you'd probably see the impressions in the wood. I'm going with the easy fix for a soft camper floor. I'm curious what the chain in the photo is holding up? 

Also, I can see in the photos that your sway bar bushings are shot! 

How do the leaf springs look with wheels on the truck and springs loaded? 

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17 hours ago, Odyssey 4x4 said:

I'm curious what the chain in the photo is holding up? 

 

That chain is for the spare tire, which I believe is standard on all Toyota pickups and RVs of that era.

17 hours ago, Odyssey 4x4 said:

Also, I can see in the photos that your sway bar bushings are shot! 

 

Thanks for letting me know! If I can get the air bags on with the sway bars, I'll make sure they replace the bushings. But at the moment I'm leaning toward removing the sway bars in favor of air bags.

17 hours ago, Odyssey 4x4 said:

How do the leaf springs look with wheels on the truck and springs loaded? 

 

Not sure how to answer that question. I'd say they look fine. Here's a couple of pictures of the RV from when I bought it 2 years ago (not full water tanks, tho).

Cheers,

Lenny

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18 hours ago, fred heath said:

The wood was put there for a reason. It’s still a Micky Mouse setup. 

Fair enough, but it solved the soft floor problem. 

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So, I've got air bags and a sway bar. They do different things. At one point my sway bar became disconnected and the handling was dangerously tippy. Air bags support suspension and leaf springs aka improved ride

Sway bar improves steering and handling. 

I really think you need to fix your existing sway bar problem

Linda S

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46 minutes ago, sweetleon said:

That chain is for the spare tire, which I believe is standard on all Toyota pickups and RVs of that era.

Thanks for letting me know! If I can get the air bags on with the sway bars, I'll make sure they replace the bushings. But at the moment I'm leaning toward removing the sway bars in favor of air bags.

Not sure how to answer that question. I'd say they look fine. Here's a couple of pictures of the RV from when I bought it 2 years ago (not full water tanks, tho).

Cheers,

Lenny

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I ask about the leaf springs to determine if that is the cause of your hard ride. When the weight of the vehicle is on the leafs, they should still retain a slight "U" shape, if they are flat or even making an upside down U, they are shot and will definitely cause a hard ride. I see there is also a helper kit installed on your leafs as well. If the leafs are okay, my next question would be the shocks. You can usually pull them off and feel if they have any life left in their movement in the form of having resistance when compressing, or seeing if they are all floppy and loose!

From the photos you provided, the truck doesn't look to be sitting too low in the rear which is a good sign. When leafs are shot you will see the rear of the vehicle sagging.

Air bags are not going to solve your sway bar issue. While airbags will certainly help improve ride quality and ride height, they do not prevent sway. The sway bar is used to brace the "coach" to the axle to prevent the coach from swaying too far left and right while turning/ driving. Eliminating the sway bar is definitely dangerous in my opinion, especially in these vehicles with high centers of gravity that are susceptible to high winds. 

Also, sway bar bushings are super cheap and super easy to change out! While the sway bar installation on your rig is certainly different and creative, I do not see any issues with it from the photos provided. It looks like it should do the job okay, and it will do it better with new bushings. You can even clean it up and paint it while it's off the vehicle. 

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Fair enough. An easy solution to the sway bar question. With tires installed, and full weight on the axle, measure the distance between the top of the axle housing to the bottom of the bump stop. Next measure the distance between the top of the sway bar bracket to wherever it contacts the frame(or body). If the distance is the same or more you’re ok. If less, your brackets are going to make contact when you bottom out.

I keep looking at your picture and it seems the support brackets are going to make contact. But my eyes aren’t what they used to be. 👀

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6 hours ago, sweetleon said:
23 hours ago, Odyssey 4x4 said:

How do the leaf springs look with wheels on the truck and springs loaded? 

 

Not sure how to answer that question

You can get an idea of how your springs are doing by getting under it with all the weight on the springs (no jacks) and looking at the springs.  This is a crude analysis, but look at my old springs on the right in the pictures below.  They are pretty much "flat" and ride height in this case is 0.5" lower than spec.  Worse, they are 'bumping" on the air bag inner safety bumpers in that picture.  The springs were tired and although with 50 psi in the air bags they did rise up to over spec height (thus being "ok" with spring plus air bag combo), I decided to change the springs.  On the left you see the new springs with no air in the air bags and they are not 'flat' but rather have some arch when you look down the spring.  The new springs sit 0.5" higher than spec height with no air in the air bags. 

IMG_20190214_141118741.jpg.b5da5986fe2bf032611b7fb6226d8cea.jpg   IMG_20190207_133722898.jpg.8f582058c50213cafb48ec533e5abdc4.jpg

Another other way you can get an idea of how your springs are doing is by measuring "ride height".  You can measure the height of the front end and the rear end and compare to the specs in the FSM.  I can post more on this if you are interested.  The key here is that, ideally, the rear frame rail should be level when parked on a level surface.  If your front end is at spec height and your frame is level on level ground then your rear springs would be doing their job ok.

Based on the pictures it doesn't look like your rig is riding all that low in the rear.  Why exactly are you interested in putting air bags in?  If you lift the rear then you will have a front to back rake and than can potentially cause your fridge to behave badly.

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That pic Derek posted is the sway bar you need. Comes off of a 4x4 Toyota truck. In San Francisco you are virtually surrounded by Pick and Pulls. I know, I've been to every single one. Part you need is there waiting or you for about 20 bucks

Linda S

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49 minutes ago, linda s said:

That pic Derek posted is the sway bar you need. Comes off of a 4x4 Toyota truck. In San Francisco you are virtually surrounded by Pick and Pulls. I know, I've been to every single one. Part you need is there waiting or you for about 20 bucks

Linda S

You're telling me there are junk yards that still have 4x4 Toyotas?! 

Not sure if mine is aftermarket or just a different setup, but the design is a bit different than Dereks photo. Could be a year variation?  (sorry for the dirty pic, I need a photo of it now restored).  

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Checking now. Your right most are 2wd but I did find a 88 Toyota box truck with the dually and axle looks intact. That will have a sway bar on it. Stockton so not too far from him. Some one here was looking for an axle too. The guy in Reno maybe?

https://www.picknpull.com/vehicle_details.aspx?VIN=JT5RN75T3J0021605

Also near Sacramento is Rancho Cordova. It's got tons of junk yards and a number that specialize in Toyota's. A few phone calls can usually track down about anything Toyota

https://www.google.com/search?source=hp&ei=Bl-xXIzgEsTksAX43pbACQ&q=toyota+junkyard+rancho+cordova+ca&oq=toyota+salvage+yard+rancho+cordova&gs_l=psy-ab.1.1.0j0i22i10i30.2450.14920..18555...0.0..0.213.5350.0j34j1......0....1..gws-wiz.....0..35i39j0i131j0i67j0i10j0i22i30.sneP1ROMUaA

I may not be a mechanic but when it comes to parts I rock

Linda S

 

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I know nothing about 4x4s. All I know is that for 'my' installation, the sway bar attaches to the axle to what appear to be two factory holes. Not so the others. The Sunrader appears to use the same two holes to attach a bar to which a sway bar is attached.

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'My' bar also appears to be bent/shaped to provide clearance for the LSPV and has nice beef end links.

BTW, what I'm calling 'my' bar is actually just a photo borrowed off the net and not actually mine. :)

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