1978 Toyota Sunrader need help

[ikm1520]

Hey All,

 

I recently bought a 1978 Toyota Sunrader as it has been a dream for a bit. Interior is great redone on most of it.  Water runs great, converted a bunch over to Solar for lights and other smaller items. However recently I have run into trouble with my Clutch pedal Switch and trying to source the correct one to buy! Any chance someone knows I can find alot of info on it for 82-90 but not so much on the years prior. 

Also the previous owner purchased LED lights for the break lights and turn signals that dont seem to respond to the turn signal lights. Work with hazards though.  Trying to figure out how to change the relay? Anyone got thoughts or advice. 

Edited October 12, 2018 by ikm1520

[gmg]

I have a 1979 sunrader which is built on the same generation of hilux as yours. I do not have a clutch switch. I have a shop manual that I will look through later to see if there is any mention of one. Do you by chance mean the clutch master cylinder? Are you unable to engage your clutch?

As for the relay, just purchase a solid state electronic blinker relay. Just installed one on mine and it took a few minutes. The relay should be near the steering column or to the right of it. Easiest way to find it is turn on your hazards and search for the thing that is clicking. One thing to mention is that with a solid state electronic relay, you will not have the audible blinker click. This is the one that I bought.

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B073J82PNF?ref=yo_pop_ma_swf

[fred heath]

11 hours ago, gmg said:

I have a 1979 sunrader which is built on the same generation of hilux as yours. I do not have a clutch switch. I have a shop manual that I will look through later to see if there is any mention of one. Do you by chance mean the clutch master cylinder? Are you unable to engage your clutch?

As for the relay, just purchase a solid state electronic blinker relay. Just installed one on mine and it took a few minutes. The relay should be near the steering column or to the right of it. Easiest way to find it is turn on your hazards and search for the thing that is clicking. One thing to mention is that with a solid state electronic relay, you will not have the audible blinker click. This is the one that I bought.

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B073J82PNF?ref=yo_pop_ma_swf

The 1978 model is different. You can not just replace the blinker relay. The blinkers and emergency flashers are controlled by a single electronic unit. They work in tandem with each other. 

[ikm1520]

Thanks for getting back to me. I recently purchased this from a guy who was rehabing it to live in, but ended up having a child and so money priorities shifted! He had been working on it so there is still a bit of mystery around the changes.

The car was starting perfectly fine not even a lag in turn over. Got cut off and stalled out and the car wont start consistently. The mechanic had the same problem and could get it to randomly turn on. So I'm not sure if the clutch isn't engaging or if its electrical. I guess a truck this old probably doesn't have the switch. 

Fred to your point there were LED break/reverse/turn signal lights installed  The front are still standard. The flashers work but cant seem to get the turn signals to trigger. Would you have another suggestion as to how to fix that or would I need to look into replacing to regular lights instead of LED.

https://www.amazon.com/PerfecTech-White-Amber-Integrated-Lights-Running/dp/B019XL2YIM

 

[WME]

Most of the time intermittent starting problems are caused by this guy...https://www.ebay.com/itm/TOYOTA-Starter-Repair-KIT-SOLENOID-CONTACTS-PLUNGER-Rebuild-Parts-Set/201532245369?fits=Make%3AToyota&hash=item2eec420579:g:80sAAOSwB4NW1GhH:sc:USPSFirstClass!80111!US!-1:rk:2:pf:0

[fred heath]

2 hours ago, ikm1520 said:

Thanks for getting back to me. I recently purchased this from a guy who was rehabing it to live in, but ended up having a child and so money priorities shifted! He had been working on it so there is still a bit of mystery around the changes.

The car was starting perfectly fine not even a lag in turn over. Got cut off and stalled out and the car wont start consistently. The mechanic had the same problem and could get it to randomly turn on. So I'm not sure if the clutch isn't engaging or if its electrical. I guess a truck this old probably doesn't have the switch. 

Fred to your point there were LED break/reverse/turn signal lights installed  The front are still standard. The flashers work but cant seem to get the turn signals to trigger. Would you have another suggestion as to how to fix that or would I need to look into replacing to regular lights instead of LED.

https://www.amazon.com/PerfecTech-White-Amber-Integrated-Lights-Running/dp/B019XL2YIM

 

I’m an advocate of when in doubt, go back to original and see what happens. Your front turn signals ground to the metal facia with the screws that hold then on. There is no separate ground wire. If your 4 ways are working, the grounds are probably good. If you buy the “Haynes” manual for your truck they carry an electrical diagram it the back along with simple circuits like start, headlights etc. it’s made for England so some of the terms used sound strange but are self evident. Good luck. 

[gmg]

8 hours ago, fred heath said:

The 1978 model is different. You can not just replace the blinker relay. The blinkers and emergency flashers are controlled by a single electronic unit. They work in tandem with each other. 

First off, my 1979 sunrader was built on a 1978 hilux. 1978 was the last year of the gen 2 hilux and the same as the OP.

Second, your point is just confusing. Yes the blinkers and hazards get their "blink" from a single flasher relay. These relays work by heating and cooling a piece of spring steel that connects and disconnects the circuit. That is the audible "click" you hear. These thermal relays require large amounts of current to heat up the spring steel. When an led replaces the incandescent bulb, the current drops to where a thermal blinker relay will no longer heat up enough to function. The OP hazards will work because the front bulbs are probably still incandescent so when all 4 lights are flashing at the same time, enough current is flowing for the thermal flasher to function correctly. Activating the turn signal would utilize one incandescent bulb and does not have enough current to function correctly. 

So you do simply replace the blinker relay.

The relay I linked in my original post is purely electronic so does not depend on a large amount of current required by a thermal relay.

To the OP, I still stand by what I said originally about fixing the blinker problem. I guarantee you that is the easiest, cheapest and best way to solve that problem.

[fred heath]

1 hour ago, gmg said:

First off, my 1979 sunrader was built on a 1978 hilux. 1978 was the last year of the gen 2 hilux and the same as the OP.

Second, your point is just confusing. Yes the blinkers and hazards get their "blink" from a single flasher relay. These relays work by heating and cooling a piece of spring steel that connects and disconnects the circuit. That is the audible "click" you hear. These thermal relays require large amounts of current to heat up the spring steel. When an led replaces the incandescent bulb, the current drops to where a thermal blinker relay will no longer heat up enough to function. The OP hazards will work because the front bulbs are probably still incandescent so when all 4 lights are flashing at the same time, enough current is flowing for the thermal flasher to function correctly. Activating the turn signal would utilize one incandescent bulb and does not have enough current to function correctly. 

So you do simply replace the blinker relay.

The relay I linked in my original post is purely electronic so does not depend on a large amount of current required by a thermal relay.

To the OP, I still stand by what I said originally about fixing the blinker problem. I guarantee you that is the easiest, cheapest and best way to solve that problem.

Sorry, but there is no exclusive plug and play “ blinker relay” on my 1979 (transion year 1978) Toyota Hilux pickup chassis. Post a picture of your “independent relay” and I’ll be happy to concede to your post. Does your truck have 2 headlights or 4?

Edited October 13, 2018 by fred heath

[gmg]

On 10/13/2018 at 5:33 PM, fred heath said:

Sorry, but there is no exclusive plug and play “ blinker relay” on my 1979 (transion year 1978) Toyota Hilux pickup chassis. Post a picture of your “independent relay” and I’ll be happy to concede to your post. Does your truck have 2 headlights or 4?

It has 4 headlights and the vents on the B pillar. Most definitely gen 2 hilux (AGAIN, same as the OP).

I decided to pull out my manual and show you the wiring diagram. Circled in red is the "Turn signal & hazard warning flasher unit". Note the two wires coming from it that go to both the "hazard warning light switch" and the "side turn signal relay". The "Turn signal & hazard warning flasher unit" is what needs to be replaced for LEDs to function correctly. The first picture shows the exact relay linked above installed in my 1978 GEN 2 hilux. Note, it is going into the STOCK connector.

It is in fact as simple as that and as close to plug and play as you can get when retrofitting something on an old rig.

Edited October 15, 2018 by gmg

[ikm1520]

GMG, thanks so much this is super helpful! 

[fred heath]

2 hours ago, gmg said:

It has 4 headlights and the vents on the B pillar. Most definitely gen 2 hilux (AGAIN, same as the OP).

I decided to pull out my manual and show you the wiring diagram. Circled in red is the "Turn signal & hazard warning flasher unit". Note the two wires coming from it that go to both the "hazard warning light switch" and the "side turn signal relay". The "Turn signal & hazard warning flasher unit" is what needs to be replaced for LEDs to function correctly. The first picture shows the exact relay linked above installed in my 1978 GEN 2 hilux. Note, it is going into the STOCK connector.

It is in fact as simple as that and as close to plug and play as you can get when retrofitting something on an old rig.

Well it might work on your truck but it’s an aftermarket (homemade) connector. This is the correct flasher assembly for this truck. So unless the OP wants to try their luck at fabrication, I still stand by my post. So it’s not like later style flashers where you can buy a relay, unplug the old and plug in the new. I’m sure the OP’s unit looks like mine, not like yours.?

Edited October 15, 2018 by fred heath

[gmg]

8 hours ago, fred heath said:

Well it might work on your truck but it’s an aftermarket (homemade) connector. This is the correct flasher assembly for this truck. So unless the OP wants to try their luck at fabrication, I still stand by my post. So it’s not like later style flashers where you can buy a relay, unplug the old and plug in the new. I’m sure the OP’s unit looks like mine, not like yours.?

Fred, I do not have the time or energy to go back and forth with someone who can not admit they are wrong but I will do it anyways to save the OP from a headache.

The picture you posted is a 2 pin flasher that has the same connector orientation as my stock plug that the new relay shown above is going into. In addition, i backed up my claims with a wiring diagram and pictures that you asked for.

Not once have you offered any legitimate solution for the OP. I know it may seem like I am inexperienced with so few posts but posts don't equate knowledge. Over the last 8 months I did a shell off complete restoration of my 79 sunrader and swapped a vw tdi engine into it. That included making a standalone engine wiring harness that required tracing, cutting and soldering 100s of wires. So I know my way around a wiring diagram and definitely know this vehicle inside and out.

To the OP, if you do want to keep the LED blinkers, I guarantee you that my solution will work. I will even put my money where my mouth is. If it doesn't work I will send you the $10 that the relay costs. That is how confident I am. Please post back and let us know how it goes.

[5Toyota]

as far as the plug in goes the original flasher in the picture is the same  plug as a 2 wire or can even use     a low or high low                                              sealed beam plug in I have done this .and yes that is the factory Toyota unit .

[fred heath]

I never said it couldn’t be done. I took exception the ease it could be done. The OP is having flasher troubles while using LED bulbs. Maybe it’s the bulbs, maybe it’s the flasher relay who knows. It’s smarter to go back to square one and see what happens with standard incandescent bulbs. If everything works as it should you can now start modifying things. It’s easy for someone who has electro/mechanical skills to modify the harness or fabricate a patch harness. Not so easy for someone who doesn’t. Don’t throw money at a problem hoping it will go away. Keeping in mind the factory relay requires it to be grounded to the chassis. You add a simple two pin relay (usually plastic) without the ground, the system won’t work correctly. I did go back and read my original response. I guess I could have worded it better. Toyota designed the turn/hazard and flasher unit to work in tandem with the original bulbs. Each component is matched to the other. That was the point I was trying to make.

@GMG. I really don’t care what you’ve done to your truck. And the blade configuration is different on the Toyota wiring harness. Why don’t you remove the electrical tape covering your harness plug. Bet we’ll see a couple of 1/4” spade terminals there. 

I’ve done a lot of work on my truck also. I never claimed to be an expert. When it comes to the Toyota wiring harness I have much experience as I had to undo 40 years worth of PO modifications. 

Edited October 16, 2018 by fred heath

[ikm1520]

Guys I really appreciate the passion and trying to help make this easy. I think the bigger problem then I am trying to rectify and learn as this is my first foray into larger vehicle repairs. The Lights that the old owner installed are these https://www.amazon.com/PerfecTech-White-Amber-Integrated-Lights-Running/dp/B019XL2YIM. They aren't just screw in LED. If I am to return to incandescent ill need to remove, Track down taillights that fit this rig and rewire them in. The front headlights/flashers are still incandescent. Any idea if working in the electric relay will cause other issues with the front Lights? 

Edited October 16, 2018 by ikm1520

[Maineah]

Electronic relay is the only fix for LED's a heater type flasher will not work properly it is a completely different concept. This of course will not fix wiring issues but everything being equal it is the only fix for a system that worked fine with the stock bulbs.

[gmg]

3 hours ago, ikm1520 said:

Guys I really appreciate the passion and trying to help make this easy. I think the bigger problem then I am trying to rectify and learn as this is my first foray into larger vehicle repairs. The Lights that the old owner installed are these https://www.amazon.com/PerfecTech-White-Amber-Integrated-Lights-Running/dp/B019XL2YIM. They aren't just screw in LED. If I am to return to incandescent ill need to remove, Track down taillights that fit this rig and rewire them in. The front headlights/flashers are still incandescent. Any idea if working in the electric relay will cause other issues with the front Lights? 

Your front incandescent bulbs will work just fine with the electronic relay. I replaced all of the bulbs in the tail lights with LED bulbs and kept the incandescent bulbs in the front. Again the only thing you will loose is the audible click when the blinkers are on.

Another option that will keep the stock relay is to use large 6ohm resistors wired between the positive and negative wire leading into the blinker at the tail light. These resistors will draw more current like the old incandescent bulb allowing the thermal relay to work. This can work but I can not guarantee it will work. I tried this first, as I like the audible click but the blinkers still only worked intermittently.  I also plan to replace the front bulbs with LED once one of them burns out and with the resistor approach, I would have had to add two more in the front. With the electronic relay, I can simply pop in the LED bulbs and be done with it.

Also the reason I recommended that specific electronic relay is because it is rated at 150 watts and can handle the current of incandescent bulbs in the front.